New Tie Rods, Need Grease Recommendation

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I'm pretty good with oil, but this grease thing has me confused. There's just too many options and types. I'm looking for a grease that works with a set of Moog tie rods in a car application. I'd also like this grease to work with utility trailer bearings, but if necessary, I can buy 2 different types. The area I live in has -35 degree temps in the winter and +35 degree temps in the summer.

There's lithium based, soap based, clay based, moly fotified, moly based, 5% moly, 3% moly, aluminum, extreme pressure, synthetic, green, red, blue, brown, cream, purple.

[censored]? If only it was as simple as buying engine oil.

It seems Ford requires moly, but most everyone else goes for lithium based. The product sheets on both types of grease claim amazing adherence to metal and superior anti-friction.

I'm installing a set of Moog tie rods and they come with grease zerks. The originals lasted 345,000 km's and were sealed. The boots are fine but there is some play in them. I've decided to spend the extra $40 to get Moogs and have peace of mind that theses will be the last tie rods I install in this car.
 
Marine grease if the trailer will ever be placed in water. It is also ok to use this in the Moogs if you flush out the original grease as they are not compatible. More important will be the frequency and purging as they are not permaneantly sealed. Disc-brake wheel bearings on the other hand need high temperature EP grease because of the extreme environment.
 
No disc brake bearings will see this grease. The trailer isn't going in the water.

Maybe I should buy the sealed Raybestos or Beck Arnley tie rods and skip the whole issue? The original Mazda sealed tie rods lasted 345,000 kms...
 
Almost any off the shelf grease you put in there that is GCLB rated will work just fine. Until recently I used Mystik JT6 hi temp in both my universials and ball joints/ tie rods.
 
Gannet167,

I've been here 9 years and the grease subject is never addressed in depth nor is a consensus ever reached about what is best. Most often, people just list their favorite and say they never had any problems. Scheduled grease application is probably as important as type, except in special needs situations.

I don't even begin to profess expertise in this area, but I will attempt to give you some decision making points. Anyone here feel free to correct or add to this.

IMO, the "good enough", "git er done" all purpose grease is lithium complex, No. 2, EP, GC-LB. It will handle regular and disc. brake bearings, all chassis points, and U joints, lawn mowers, etc..

After this choice, you can decide if you want more specialized thickener (aluminum, calcium, polyurea), base oil (dino/synthetic), or additives (moly). Color has absolutely no association with quality.

Some rules of thumb, generalities, etc.:

Moly grease is better for "metal to metal" sliding parts. Lots here think its better for chassis parts, front end loaders (pins), etc..

U joints are controversial - no consensus about moly.

Wheel bearings - most think no moly, despite Fords practices. No consensus here either.

Again, the Lithium complex will get the job done and you can sleep well at night with this choice. For "I need the bestest best", or construction equipment, boat trailers, fifth wheels, etc., consider other stuff.

Your temperature extreme may need to be addressed, but number 2 is most common.
 
I dont know that you can have a bad choice really. Id go syn grease given your temperature requirements, but doubt that you will have a bad choice if you run amsoil, mobil1, etc. I would email moog with your part numbers, and ask what kind of grease they use. Then use the grease compatability chart found on this site to verify that youre using a good grease.
 
I used Valvoline Durablend, as it was what was available, relatively cheap and seemed to be the all singing and dancing grease - at least of those available. However, I ran out of it before filling up both tie rods and I can't get it any more.

I'm now limited to the Castrol multipurpose, Motormaster Synthetic (probably just re-labelled M1), Lucas X-tra #2, Motormaster EP with Moly, or Quaker State Golden.

The QS Golden seems to be the high tech of these options, although the Lucas says it stays soft in very cold temps - but it has no friction additive, but is "Approved Lube for Life" spec. Or maybe plain old MM EP with moly is the way to go...
 
Lucas X-tra is a poly-urea based grease which is apparently incompatible with most other greases, even though their website says "compatible with most non-synthetic greases" . Since I already put a little Valvoline Durablend into one tie rod, I guess I can't continue filling it with an incompatible grease.

Unless I can get another tube of Durablend, I guess it'll be Quaker State Golden grease (not the regular QS grease). It's not listed on their website at all but my Napa store carries it.
 
Originally Posted By: Gannet167
I'm pretty good with oil, but this grease thing has me confused. There's just too many options and types. I'm looking for a grease that works with a set of Moog tie rods in a car application. I'd also like this grease to work with utility trailer bearings, but if necessary, I can buy 2 different types. The area I live in has -35 degree temps in the winter and +35 degree temps in the summer.

There's lithium based, soap based, clay based, moly fotified, moly based, 5% moly, 3% moly, aluminum, extreme pressure, synthetic, green, red, blue, brown, cream, purple.

[censored]? If only it was as simple as buying engine oil.

It seems Ford requires moly, but most everyone else goes for lithium based. The product sheets on both types of grease claim amazing adherence to metal and superior anti-friction.

I'm installing a set of Moog tie rods and they come with grease zerks. The originals lasted 345,000 km's and were sealed. The boots are fine but there is some play in them. I've decided to spend the extra $40 to get Moogs and have peace of mind that theses will be the last tie rods I install in this car.
First, a couple of grease facts:
--Grease is a mixture of base thickener, oil, and additives
----The base (thickener) holds the oil and is usually chemically a soap. It can be lithium or lithium complex, or aluminum complex, or calcium sulfonate, or bentonite (clay), or silica, or other products. Many cannot be used together (incompatible) where the mixture turns into a black, watery mess. Stick with lithium complex or aluminum complex.
http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/1865/grease-compatibility
----The type of oil only matters the same as any oil. Conventional oil works fine. Synthetic oil works better under some conditions. Syn blend works also. Compatibility is not a factor.
----Additives include moly, graphite, Teflon (OK in grease, NG in motor oil), extreme pressure agents, tackifiers, dye, etc.

So, stick with lithium, lithium complex, or aluminum complex base greases. Clay base is good for high temperatures and not compatible with other bases. Use either conventional or synthetic oil greases. 5% moly is too much except for slow moving parts like Cat excavator bucket pins. 3% moly is a practical max. The consistency of grease ranges from semi-fluid (#0000) to solid (#6). Stick with National Lubricating Grease Institute NLGI #2 consistency. NLGI rating LB is good for auto chassis. NLGI rating GC is good for wheel bearings. A grease rated GC-LB is good all-round. The color doesn't matter.
 
I called Lucas today to ask about their X-tra Heavy Duty. Although a Polyurea, it claims to be compatible with most non-syn greases (although synthetic grease is a marketing term only) anyway the tech lady told me it IS compatible, but I should definitely clean as much of the lithium based stuff off first. To which I replied, "so it's not really that compatible then" to which she replied "I don't understand you question, it IS compatible, but you'd have to clean the other grease out first." Oh, ok, thanks for your time.

I called them because some of the grease compatibility charts list polyurea as "maybe" compatible and since Lucas claims compatibility with "most" i figured they might be one of the ones that is. It apparently isn't compatible.

So, Quaker State Golden is apparently great stuff depending what forum you read - but isn't CG rated, only LB, so it's out.

I know I'm over thinking this, but most of the commentary on this site is vastly over thinking lubrication. I think I'll go with Chevron Starplex EP. No moly, it's pink but looks decent.
 
Ideally you should not use any grease that doesn't contain molybdenum disulphide on your inner and outer tie rods, rack and pinion, ball joints, and CV joints. These joints go under tremendous forces and a simple grease with no good extreme-pressure additive (basically anything other than molybdenum disulphide) isn't enough.

Molybdenum disulphide is the best extreme-pressure additive for greases. It has extraordinary antiscore and antifriction benefits for the boundary-lubrication regime, where there is no oil film between the sliding parts due to high forces (pressure). Molybdenum disulphide is dark grey and the greases that contain it are also of this color.

Incidentally I just had my steering-rack boots replaced and I had the inner tie rods packed with Valvoline Synpower synthetic moly grease (lithium complex). The aftermarket inner tide rods originally had the grease came with them in a small bag, which was a yellow grease (therefore nonmoly). For some reason the steering feel got noticeably better -- razor-sharp -- after the moly grease, with now zero freeplay and quicker response. I am guessing that moly decreases friction and therefore it decreases backlash and increases steering response.

Regarding the categories, there are two: LB and GC-LB. LB means chassis lubrication (including steering) only. GC-LB means chassis lubrication and lubrication for wheel bearings for disk-brake-equipped wheels. The difference is that GC-LB can be used in higher temperatures because it uses usually lithium-complex soap, capable of somewhat higher temperatures. For chassis and steering (your case), either LB or GC-LB is fine.

A grease is made of the following:

Base oil (like in motor oil): Most of the grease (~ 70%). Could be conventional or synthetic. Synthetic base oil is capable of wider temperature ranges, including colder.
Thickener: Lithium-12-hydroxystearate or lithium-complex soap is the most optimal thickener, unless you need water resistance. It has great corrosion resistance and lubrication properties. Lithium complex is somewhat better than lithium 12-hydroxystearate, as it can withstand higher temperatures and can qualify for the GC-LB category (lubrication for wheel bearings for disk-brake-equipped wheels, in addition to chassis lube [LB]).
Additives: There are a few additives, the most important being the extreme-pressure additives that reduce scoring and decrease friction. The best extreme-pressure additive for grease is molybdenum disulphide, as explained above.
 
Quote:
I called Lucas today to ask about their X-tra Heavy Duty. Although a Polyurea, it claims to be compatible with most non-syn greases (although synthetic grease is a marketing term only) anyway the tech lady told me it IS compatible, but I should definitely clean as much of the lithium based stuff off first. To which I replied, "so it's not really that compatible then" to which she replied "I don't understand you question, it IS compatible, but you'd have to clean the other grease out first." Oh, ok, thanks for your time.

Yet another reason not to use Lucas products.

Quote:
Molybdenum disulphide is the best extreme-pressure additive for greases. It has extraordinary antiscore and antifriction benefits for the boundary-lubrication regime, where there is no oil film between the sliding parts due to high forces (pressure).

Moly is a good add but it is far from the best. Conventional EP adds will have far higher load bearing ability and become part of the metal itself. I think moly is mostly a last resort type thing as well a friction reducer. It is also good for shock loading.

There are plenty of GC-LB greases out there without moly in them.
 
Originally Posted By: Tempest
Conventional EP adds will have far higher load bearing ability and become part of the metal itself. I think moly is mostly a last resort type thing as well a friction reducer. It is also good for shock loading.

There are plenty of GC-LB greases out there without moly in them.

In fact, molybdenum disulphide is a conventional extreme-pressure additive. It does become part of the metal surfaces by creating a layer of Mo - S lattice on the metal surfaces when they are under high pressure and friction. This layer is an antiscore, antiwear, antifriction, and antioxidant layer.

NLGI GC-LB (disk-brake-wheel-bearing and chassis grease) means for higher temperatures (capable of handling the heat of the disk brakes in the wheel bearings). It's no better than NLGI LB (chassis grease) in pressure handling. It's only for higher temperatures, not for higher pressures, although not high-enough temperatures to use directly on brake calipers -- only wheel bearings with disk brakes.
 
Originally Posted By: Gokhan

In fact, molybdenum disulphide is a conventional extreme-pressure additive. It does become part of the metal surfaces by creating a layer of Mo - S lattice on the metal surfaces when they are under high pressure and friction. This layer is an antiscore, antiwear, antifriction, and antioxidant layer.

^Correct that's why it's the "go to" grease for anything that "slides", pins,bushings,5th wheels,steering joints,drive lines, etc,etc,it's the ONLY type grease we use in our operations.

we even use it in lithium form in slow moving bearings,everything else gets Alum complex of course.
 
Originally Posted By: Gannet167
The area I live in has -35 degree temps in the winter and +35 degree temps in the summer.

My only advise is to move
crazy2.gif
Your upper temps are 40* lower than my comfort temp.
 
Originally Posted By: Chris142
Originally Posted By: Gannet167
The area I live in has -35 degree temps in the winter and +35 degree temps in the summer.

My only advise is to move
crazy2.gif
Your upper temps are 40* lower than my comfort temp.

I think he's giving the temperature range in Celsius. -35 C to +35 C would be -31 F to 95 F in Fahrenheit.
smile.gif
 
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