which non detergent oils do you know of?

[racepak]

hi guys, i'm new here,
i have just rebuilt my honda D16 engine
i was told that i need a non detergent oil to brake in my engine,
i live in israel and we dont have oils like penzoil or brad penn or shell,

but we do have castrol,mobil1,valvoline,motul,ac delco,royal purple, silkolene ,ford motocraft, agip, liqui moly and thats about it,

do you guys know which one of them makes non detergent oil? i'v read that the castrol gtx is non detergend but the bottle says "fight sludge"

also,
i will appriciate your help if you could help me which viscosity to choose by the following specs:
main and rod bearing clearance: .0015"
piston to wall clearance .038"
journal bearing Turbo
thanks

 

[tinmanSC]

Originally Posted By: racepak
hi guys, i'm new here,
i have just rebuilt my honda D16 engine
i was told that i need a non detergent oil to brake in my engine,


Who told you that?

 

[JT1]

Recip aircraft engines are broken in on sae 50 Non-detergent oil, then switch over to an ashless dispersant oil usually multi-visc.

Well at least it used to be that way. As of recent more aircraft engines are broken in on what they intend to use for the duration of TBO.

I'm thinking that may be where this "break in on ND oil" may have originated, and realize that most builders have moved away from this practice.

Oem Auto mfgs. break in with standard detergent multi-visc. oil, and sometimes even synthetic( Mercedes uses Mobil 1 0W40 as there assembly lube). So why one would think they need to do differently is beyond me.

I personally would use a 15w40 hdeo, and I will be when I fire up my 4g63t for the first time after rebuild.

 

[racepak]

some guys in honda forums told me that,

israel is usualy hotter than the usa.

would it be wise to use 10w50?

i used 10w60 on my last engine but all my rod bearings faild,

 

[justinf89]

Those clearances can take a 30 weight. What are you doing with it? Assumptions can't be made on clearances alone.

 

[ahoier]

Last I checked, jegs.com had "break in oil" - but as mentioned...many big time car manufacturers are sending their cars to the LOTS with regular grade "multi viscosity" oils....intended to be ran anywhere from 3-8k on the oil - or some of the newer ones, per the manual state to run the Oil until the OLM states to change it even....

The only non-detergent I know of would be the Accel lol - believe it's bottled by Warren Petroleum, or Unilube or something...but may not be available in Israel...

 

[Chris142]

The use of ND oil to break in an engine goes back to the 50's. ND oils are also very low on Antiwear addatives. Right when a new engine needs AW addatives the most.

I wouldn't use ND oil ever. Not even as a break in oil. I'd use a major brand around a 5w30 or 10w30 and a break in addative along with it.

 

[LC4RN8]

Any 15w-40 diesel oil should do you well.

 

[racepak]

this engine is going to see alot of "abuse" around 400hp tops,
it has a very hot cam and it should idle at around 1000rpm and have a rev limit at 9000rpm.

 

[JT1]

Originally Posted By: racepak
this engine is going to see alot of "abuse" around 400hp tops,
it has a very hot cam and it should idle at around 1000rpm and have a rev limit at 9000rpm.


I would love to see a dyno and build sheet when you get a.chance

 

[Billy_D]

Originally Posted By: Chris142
...I wouldn't use ND oil ever. Not even as a break in oil...


+1

 

[229]

Detergent competes with zinc and phosphorus for attachment to metal surfaces. Joe Gibbs break-in oils and others have low detergent to help with the break-in of flat tappet cams. HDEO has high detergent level.

 

[Stelth]

When I took an engine rebuilding class about 25 years ago, we were taught that the best way to break in an engine was with non-detergent oil. The idea was that any large particles that broke loose during the original run-in would settle to the bottom of the pan rather than being suspended.

Our teacher said that on initial start-up, you should run the engine for 20 min. @ 2000 rpm with 20 weight ND oil, and change the oil and filter. Then run 100 miles with 20 weight ND oil, and change the oil and filter. Then use whatever oil the manufacturer recommends.

I doubt than anybody follows this process any more. I'm just posting it in answer to those who wonder where this idea came from.

 

[racepak]

i dont have a dyno sheet yet since the engine isnt running yet,

how about the rotella sb 10w30?

 

[Michael_P]

I have rebuilt a slew of engines in the past 25 years. I would say that's kind of old school. All my rebuilds are successful too. Flat tappet? go high ZnPh. Assembly lube is loaded with moly. To answer your question (Stelth) as to where this idea came from, I have no idea. Most rebuilders I know like a robust add-pack with lots of anti wear stuff. Furthermore, you would want a range of RPM's to seat the rings in properly. 2000RPM for 20min does not fit the bill.