Maybe "eating" is a bit overkill in terms of description, but this '07 Altima with the QR25DE has had two oxygen sensors and its exhaust manifold w/ catalytic converter replaced under warranty. One O2 sensor & cat at 35,008 miles, and one rear O2 sensor replaced at 44,743 miles. The CEL for another rear O2 sensor lit up about 15k miles ago, and the vehicle now has 90k. What could be causing these sensors to foul this frequently? Since it's a rear O2 sensor, should I bother replacing it? I recall reading somewhere that its only function is to ensure that the cat is operating within efficiency, and it absolutely should be since it's only 55k old.
07 Altima (QR25DE) eating oxygen sensors
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Any idea what the code (codes) is that it's throwing. Sounds like shades or some variation of the 02-03 2.5L ticking time fiasco that I was victim of earlier this year and posted about here.
The O2 sensor code can actually signal other issues besides the O2 sensor. The precat or cat could be deteriorating causing the O2 sensors to throw a code.
Nissan precats have been an issues in many Nissan engine including the 3.5L as posted here, but the 2.5L engine is notoriously bad.
Congrats though for getting an exhaust manifold and catalytic converter out of Nissan. Suspect they are throwing parts at it wtihout actually fixing the real issue. But, theat would be more than Nissan did for the 02-03 2.5l owners who Nissan hoodooedwith a bogus recall that fixed nothing and left owners literally and figuratively by the side of the road.
I have no answers except that the 2.5L has a very bad history including the exhaust and precat system, and has added to Nissan reputation of producing non reliable vehicles.
Good luck, and I'd be interested in you keeping this updated.
The O2 sensor code can actually signal other issues besides the O2 sensor. The precat or cat could be deteriorating causing the O2 sensors to throw a code.
Nissan precats have been an issues in many Nissan engine including the 3.5L as posted here, but the 2.5L engine is notoriously bad.
Congrats though for getting an exhaust manifold and catalytic converter out of Nissan. Suspect they are throwing parts at it wtihout actually fixing the real issue. But, theat would be more than Nissan did for the 02-03 2.5l owners who Nissan hoodooedwith a bogus recall that fixed nothing and left owners literally and figuratively by the side of the road.
I have no answers except that the 2.5L has a very bad history including the exhaust and precat system, and has added to Nissan reputation of producing non reliable vehicles.
Good luck, and I'd be interested in you keeping this updated.
P0137, "O2 Sensor Circuit Low Voltage (Bank 1 Sensor 2)"
I tried clearing the code twice, came back both times. Next time I'm under the car for an oil change (about 500 miles) I'll try to locate and verify the connection and wiring of the sensor. Mileage seems to be unaffected.
I am aware of the pre-cat issues with earlier gen Altimas, but one would figure Nissan would have solved them by the 2007MY and new generation.
I tried clearing the code twice, came back both times. Next time I'm under the car for an oil change (about 500 miles) I'll try to locate and verify the connection and wiring of the sensor. Mileage seems to be unaffected.
I am aware of the pre-cat issues with earlier gen Altimas, but one would figure Nissan would have solved them by the 2007MY and new generation.
Quote:
I am aware of the pre-cat issues with earlier gen Altimas, but one would figure Nissan would have solved them by the 2007MY and new generation.
Yes, one would think that. But the fact Nissan had to replace the exhaust manifold and cat under warranty might seem to indicate otherwise. Assuming that with the manifold replacement the precat (if they still had them) got replaced too.
It is a different code though than mine, 0420.
One thing for sure imo, the exhaust manifold and cat system should not have had to be replaced with that low miles. And O2 sensors shouldn't be failing that quickly either.
I am aware of the pre-cat issues with earlier gen Altimas, but one would figure Nissan would have solved them by the 2007MY and new generation.
Yes, one would think that. But the fact Nissan had to replace the exhaust manifold and cat under warranty might seem to indicate otherwise. Assuming that with the manifold replacement the precat (if they still had them) got replaced too.
It is a different code though than mine, 0420.
One thing for sure imo, the exhaust manifold and cat system should not have had to be replaced with that low miles. And O2 sensors shouldn't be failing that quickly either.
This was my brother's vehicle so he just brought it in to diagnose the CEL while it was under warranty - I have no idea what codes were present when the cat and O2 sensor were replaced, nor the code for the one rear O2 sensor that was later replaced as well.
I'll bring a copy of these records and see what the service adviser thinks about these recurring O2 sensor issues next time I visit the dealer.
I'll bring a copy of these records and see what the service adviser thinks about these recurring O2 sensor issues next time I visit the dealer.
Originally Posted By: sayjac
the fact Nissan had to replace the exhaust manifold and cat under warranty might seem to indicate otherwise
Well, keep in mind that this is what one particular dealer decided to do and I bet they got paid a pretty penny (by Nissan) to do it. Dealers don't necessarily replace things because that's what is necessary and what Nissan itself says to do. They do it because Nissan will pay for it and it puts more money in the dealer's pocket.
the fact Nissan had to replace the exhaust manifold and cat under warranty might seem to indicate otherwise
Well, keep in mind that this is what one particular dealer decided to do and I bet they got paid a pretty penny (by Nissan) to do it. Dealers don't necessarily replace things because that's what is necessary and what Nissan itself says to do. They do it because Nissan will pay for it and it puts more money in the dealer's pocket.
Check your owners manual to see if it's a related part under a lengthy federally mandated emissions warranty.
I know the cat(s) and computer are, IDK about the rear o2.
I know in Florida you don't need to pass smog, but if you punish Nissan's pocketbook, they might make better cars for the rest of us.
I know the cat(s) and computer are, IDK about the rear o2.
I know in Florida you don't need to pass smog, but if you punish Nissan's pocketbook, they might make better cars for the rest of us.
Originally Posted By: barlowc
Originally Posted By: sayjac
the fact Nissan had to replace the exhaust manifold and cat under warranty might seem to indicate otherwise
Well, keep in mind that this is what one particular dealer decided to do and I bet they got paid a pretty penny (by Nissan) to do it. Dealers don't necessarily replace things because that's what is necessary and what Nissan itself says to do. They do it because Nissan will pay for it and it puts more money in the dealer's pocket.
The fact that this dealer replaced these parts indicates 'to me' that they obviously believed/ascertained there to be some failure/defect in one or both those two parts. One would think there would be some basis, ie., history, internal TSB, etc., to 'start' with that parts replacement. IMO, not a minor parts replacement for a CEL in a relatively low mileage vehicle, way more than just replacing an O2 sensor or two. As I said, I'm not sure they they know the real issue or how to fix it, and the fact that the O2 sensors regularly now fail, seems to bare that out. But, starting with two major parts on a low miles vehicle wouldn't be good, imo. Also, the OP is not sure of the original code/codes that led to the replacement, which would be more illuminating. But yes, I'm certain Nissan paid for it, not the dealer.
After thinking some, eljefino has brought up a good point. As the OP's vehicle threw a CEL, Nissan is liable to replace these parts likely under the extended emission warranty which would be difficult to get around. Also, that is a difference between the OP's vehicle and and all the 02-03 2.5L Nissans which didn't throw a CEL code until it was too late, generally out of warranty, and the engine fried. Except for spirited SpecV drivers who ended up with a new engine under warranty, whether the precat defect was also fixed is very doubtful.
This sounds to me like another Nissan 2.5L engine with exhaust manifold/precat/catalytic converter system defect.
Originally Posted By: sayjac
the fact Nissan had to replace the exhaust manifold and cat under warranty might seem to indicate otherwise
Well, keep in mind that this is what one particular dealer decided to do and I bet they got paid a pretty penny (by Nissan) to do it. Dealers don't necessarily replace things because that's what is necessary and what Nissan itself says to do. They do it because Nissan will pay for it and it puts more money in the dealer's pocket.
The fact that this dealer replaced these parts indicates 'to me' that they obviously believed/ascertained there to be some failure/defect in one or both those two parts. One would think there would be some basis, ie., history, internal TSB, etc., to 'start' with that parts replacement. IMO, not a minor parts replacement for a CEL in a relatively low mileage vehicle, way more than just replacing an O2 sensor or two. As I said, I'm not sure they they know the real issue or how to fix it, and the fact that the O2 sensors regularly now fail, seems to bare that out. But, starting with two major parts on a low miles vehicle wouldn't be good, imo. Also, the OP is not sure of the original code/codes that led to the replacement, which would be more illuminating. But yes, I'm certain Nissan paid for it, not the dealer.
After thinking some, eljefino has brought up a good point. As the OP's vehicle threw a CEL, Nissan is liable to replace these parts likely under the extended emission warranty which would be difficult to get around. Also, that is a difference between the OP's vehicle and and all the 02-03 2.5L Nissans which didn't throw a CEL code until it was too late, generally out of warranty, and the engine fried. Except for spirited SpecV drivers who ended up with a new engine under warranty, whether the precat defect was also fixed is very doubtful.
This sounds to me like another Nissan 2.5L engine with exhaust manifold/precat/catalytic converter system defect.
The dealer replaced both sensors and the cat.
Gosh, just replace everything! That'll fix her up!
Who knows what was actually bad and why?
Gosh, just replace everything! That'll fix her up!
Who knows what was actually bad and why?
The warranty booklet states that only the computer and catalytic converters are covered for 8 yr/80k (I think it said 80k, anyway). So I doubt I would get any compensation or at least free replacement of this O2 sensor from Nissan.
So, what's the verdict for the current bad O2 sensor? Leave it alone, since it's just a postcat sensor, and just keep monitoring every few months for any new codes?
So, what's the verdict for the current bad O2 sensor? Leave it alone, since it's just a postcat sensor, and just keep monitoring every few months for any new codes?
Town, that is INCORRECT, by federal law the manufacturer is REQUIRED to warranty ANY emissions related part and that includes the O2 sensors, and any other emissions related component, like an EGR valve, air pump, carbon canister, ect. ANY EMISSIONS RELATED PART.
Don't take no for an answer just make sure to tell them politely that according to the federal emissions law they must warranty that part, if the dealer gives you trouble tell them you will be calling the manufacturer and the EPA, I doubt you'll have any resistance then.
Don't take no for an answer just make sure to tell them politely that according to the federal emissions law they must warranty that part, if the dealer gives you trouble tell them you will be calling the manufacturer and the EPA, I doubt you'll have any resistance then.
All emissions components except for the computer and catalytic converters are warranted for 3 years/36k miles, both of which have been surpassed on this Altima. I failed to mention that, sorry for being unclear.
Honestly, I would do a couple of things:
First off, I would try disconnecting and reconnecting the offending sensor, just in case there is a connection issue, since the error code points to voltage.
Second, I would swap the O2 sensor with a good one from a friend's car, and see if that makes any change in both of our vehicles. Luckily I have a couple of friends locally that own same gen Altima's.
If that makes a difference, then I know what part to buy.
If it doesn't, then I would be looking at the wiring, and see if the dealer put the wiring correctly back into place. If I see it melted somewhere, THEY have to fix it because of their sloppy work.
If there isn't damaged wiring, then I would test the voltage being supplied to the O2 sensor to see if it's in spec or not. If not, then that might require ECU replacement, and that is still under warranty.
BC.
First off, I would try disconnecting and reconnecting the offending sensor, just in case there is a connection issue, since the error code points to voltage.
Second, I would swap the O2 sensor with a good one from a friend's car, and see if that makes any change in both of our vehicles. Luckily I have a couple of friends locally that own same gen Altima's.
If that makes a difference, then I know what part to buy.
If it doesn't, then I would be looking at the wiring, and see if the dealer put the wiring correctly back into place. If I see it melted somewhere, THEY have to fix it because of their sloppy work.
If there isn't damaged wiring, then I would test the voltage being supplied to the O2 sensor to see if it's in spec or not. If not, then that might require ECU replacement, and that is still under warranty.
BC.
check the bung plug where the o2 sensors screw in.. the welds were pretty dismal and leaked which to me caused the o2 sensors to fail faster.
nissan should have had this issue fixed by 2005.
my sister fot a new motor at 49k for her 02 as well as a new man-cat.
I had to have a friend put some more weld on the front sensor and it held for a while, next thing I know, october 31st 2009 I'm spending the day hunting down a new man-cat and found it at the dealer, who gave me a 20% discount because he said he was being nice, I think he was goign to avoid an argument.. $550 for that and it bolted up nicely.
the bung plug has a much better weld job on it. a new o2 sensor and I hope the car goes away before the next issue, whatever it might be.
nissan should have had this issue fixed by 2005.
my sister fot a new motor at 49k for her 02 as well as a new man-cat.
I had to have a friend put some more weld on the front sensor and it held for a while, next thing I know, october 31st 2009 I'm spending the day hunting down a new man-cat and found it at the dealer, who gave me a 20% discount because he said he was being nice, I think he was goign to avoid an argument.. $550 for that and it bolted up nicely.
the bung plug has a much better weld job on it. a new o2 sensor and I hope the car goes away before the next issue, whatever it might be.
One of my friends owns a 2009 Altima so I can probably borrow his sensor one day. I'll just need to get an O2 sensor socket and I'll be set... but first I'll verify connections and voltages before swapping out the sensor. I also spoke to the service adviser today and he said that he didn't know why another dealership replaced the man/cat at 35k miles, and also said that there is definitely no warranty anymore for the O2 sensors for this vehicle.
I connected a generic scan tool and the voltage for the oxygen sensor read 0.28v if I recall correctly. The car is just about due for an oil change but I will not be able to access it for one or two weeks, so I can't examine the wiring until then.
yeah the voltage should be constantly changing..
the wiring shouldn't be an issue, as nissan did pretty good routing the o2 sensor wire away from heat sources..
the wiring shouldn't be an issue, as nissan did pretty good routing the o2 sensor wire away from heat sources..
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