ROTELLA T6 Research! Please advise? Thanks

[Proton]

Originally Posted By: Qwiky
For your climate you don't need a 5w40. I would consider any of the good named HDEO 15w40s and save your money. From all of the UOAs that are on this forum and elswhere they will return as good if not better than the 5w40.

For racing look at rraiderr's recommendations. Although there are racers using HDEOs with good results also. The question you need to answer for that application is what is the maximum oil temperature going to be. Synthetics provide about 30-40 degrees celsuis more headroom over dino oils.

Gauteng, South Africa weather:

Dry winters with chilly mornings - temperatures average between 5 and 19 degrees Celsius.

Warm summers with balmy nights - temperatures average between 17 and 28 degrees Celsius

EDIT: For racing HTHS is also worth looking at.


So if I use the normal Shell Helix 15w40 that I have been using on my car it would be fine? its not a Synthetic oil though... But its is more expensive than the normal car oils...
here is a links :
http://www.shell.com/home/content/zaf/pr..._new/helix_hx5/

If you guys say its not necessary to use these expensive oils then Im starting to wonder why are they so expensive then....

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Proton

If you guys say its not necessary to use these expensive oils then Im starting to wonder why are they so expensive then....

I keep repeating myself, but since you keep asking the same question, I'll say it again: they're more expensive because you can run them twice as long (a simplification). So you may be able to change them every 8-10K miles as opposed to 3-4K miles with mineral, for example. Isn't the longer OCI and the time saved by not having to do frequent oil changes worth something?

As the previous poster mentioned, synthetics also have a bit of an advantage at extremely high engine temps. In regular street applications, it's irrelevant. On the race track, it might be something to consider.

 

[Proton]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Proton

If you guys say its not necessary to use these expensive oils then Im starting to wonder why are they so expensive then....

I keep repeating myself, but since you keep asking the same question, I'll say it again: they're more expensive because you can run them twice as long (a simplification). So you may be able to change them every 8-10K miles as opposed to 3-4K miles with mineral, for example. Isn't the longer OCI and the time saved by not having to do frequent oil changes worth something?

As the previous poster mentioned, synthetics also have a bit of an advantage at extremely high engine temps. In regular street applications, it's irrelevant. On the race track, it might be something to consider.


Ok I hear you, thanks so much.. I went to the shop to see if I can find any other good oils to use, but I ended up finding some more versions of the Rimula oil, and one or two other types.. will post pics in a bit

 

[Proton]

And then there was Mibil 1, but it was 0W40 and it was TOTALLY out of my reach cost wise... R550 for 4L where the others are between R150-R350 for 5L and some are full Synthetic...

 

[G-MAN]

Originally Posted By: Proton
And then there was Mibil 1, but it was 0W40 and it was TOTALLY out of my reach cost wise... R550 for 4L where the others are between R150-R350 for 5L and some are full Synthetic...


Asseblief, man. I remember when the Rand was on par with the dollar. Looks like that's not the case anymore.

I would not use a friction modified oil (like Helix) in a shared sump wet clutch bike. Stick with JASO approve oils, or a HD oil like Rimula.

 

[Quattro Pete]

oooh... I like that LM Racing 4T. If the price is good, I'd use it.

 

[Proton]

Originally Posted By: G-MAN
Originally Posted By: Proton
And then there was Mibil 1, but it was 0W40 and it was TOTALLY out of my reach cost wise... R550 for 4L where the others are between R150-R350 for 5L and some are full Synthetic...


Asseblief, man. I remember when the Rand was on par with the dollar. Looks like that's not the case anymore.

I would not use a friction modified oil (like Helix) in a shared sump wet clutch bike. Stick with JASO approve oils, or a HD oil like Rimula.


I hear what you are saying, But im not sure about the JASO MA rating on the Rimula, and im not even sure if its synthetic or not.. I think I should try and phone the number on the can and hear what they say...

Does anyone know this Liqui Moly oil? Im a bit skeptic as I have never heard of or seen it before?

 

[Proton]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
oooh... I like that LM Racing 4T. If the price is good, I'd use it.


But is this a Known oil?

 

[Quattro Pete]

LubroMoly/LiquiMoly is very well known, especially when it comes to Euro-spec oil. I don't have any experience with their motorcycle oil, but I wouldn't be afraid to try it.

I'm using LM 75w-90 synthetic gear oil in the rear diff of my 530i.

 

[va3ux]

In S.A., you may have access to Shell Advance 4T motorcycle oil - a product that is NOT available in north america. Apparently it's good stuff and recommended by Ducati.

If you can't resolve the Rotella T6 equivalency question, consider the Shell motorcycle oil (it you have it available)

 

[Qwiky]

You guys in SA have Rimula like us Aussies. I don't know what the equivalency is to the Rotella line as va3ux refers.

If you grab the PDSs for both and do some cross checks you may be able to work it out.

The other 15w40 HDEOs that have a lot of UOA data on this forum and others are Chevron (Caltex) Delo 400, Mobil Delvac 1300 (likely MX ESP in Australia)

 

[Qwiky]

Ok, I did a cross check for you and my own interest.

It appears that Rimula R4L is equivalent to Rotella T 15w40 as far as the "SPECIFICATIONS AND APPROVALS" go on the PDSs except that it does not have "S" specs or JASO MA spec. Rotella includes those specs.

So the question is - is it the same? It's designed to perform the same, I would be surprised if it is different.

 

[RC46_Rider]

Here is a RADICAL thought !!

EMAIL Shell's tech dept. and ASK what is DIFFERENT between
Rotella T and the Rimula. Ask them about applications in a
gasoline engine.

My experience has been that they are pretty straight forward.

A little aggressive questioning of the manufacturer could pay off hansomely! After all, they make the stuff !!...they should know
quite a bit about their own products !!

 

[Proton]

I hear what your saying but THIS South Africa! EVERYTHING here is either Stolen, Imported or Copied! NOTHING gets CREATED here so they will have NO CLUE! lol, I have phoned them and the lady on the other end didn't even know the different oil series they sell! lol... Maybe the tech dep would know yes, will email and hear what they say.

thanks

 

[Qwiky]

RC46_Rider, already tried that.

Shell Australia were very guarded and didn't want to discuss cross market diferences, instead opting to recommend their motorcycle oils.

I have tried about three times over the last year or so and it is the same response everytime, even when I mentioned mixed fleet usage. They just go on to say the HDEOs don't have S specs and so they don't recommend them.

Best way is to do a VOA and some UOAs IMO.

 

[RC46_Rider]

Yes, I can understand the problems you are running into trying to get info. I have hit the same thing a time or two.
Here in the U.S. lawyers essentially tell companies what they can say, so the "tech people" just repeat canned messages. You have to get "creative" sometimes to get a straight answer.

I would try the U.S. Tech dept. on the U.S. website. I would feed them some line and not tell them you are not a U.S. customer....or tell them you have a machine that spec's Rotella T and what can you use that is idential? I bet they have data on export products too.....OR Tell them some buddy got the stuff off a ship or something and you want to know if it is an EQUAL substitute for Rotella T. ...or tell them you have a new small DIESEL garden made in Korea (tell them it is a new Hyundai product that just came out!) that has a wet clutch and will that oil hurt the clutch.
You gotta work the system a little some times !!
The big corporations mess with us (a lot!) so turning the table on them is fair. ...or as you note, do some VOA's, but that is kind of expensive and the cost of that may offset any savings.

Aren't big corporations just a ball of fun to deal with !!

Good luck........

 

[Proton]

Originally Posted By: RC46_Rider
Yes, I can understand the problems you are running into trying to get info. I have hit the same thing a time or two.
Here in the U.S. lawyers essentially tell companies what they can say, so the "tech people" just repeat canned messages. You have to get "creative" sometimes to get a straight answer.

I would try the U.S. Tech dept. on the U.S. website. I would feed them some line and not tell them you are not a U.S. customer....or tell them you have a machine that spec's Rotella T and what can you use that is idential? I bet they have data on export products too.....OR Tell them some buddy got the stuff off a ship or something and you want to know if it is an EQUAL substitute for Rotella T. ...or tell them you have a new small DIESEL garden made in Korea (tell them it is a new Hyundai product that just came out!) that has a wet clutch and will that oil hurt the clutch.
You gotta work the system a little some times !!
The big corporations mess with us (a lot!) so turning the table on them is fair. ...or as you note, do some VOA's, but that is kind of expensive and the cost of that may offset any savings.

Aren't big corporations just a ball of fun to deal with !!

Good luck........


Haha, thats a good Idea, thanks Mate.

 

[Qwiky]

From what I can gather it is the marketing departments that want to control what the market segments are getting.

I am willing to make a bet that Rotella T is Rimula 4L but Shell have their reasons to not want some markets to know this.

 

[danjholmes]

I have a kawasaki vulcan 900, My 2 brothers have yamaha vstars 1600, and they were telling me to use nothing but syn mc oil, amsoil or mobil 1. After doing much research on internet, I was impressed with shell rotella T6 5w40. wal mart sells it for approx 20.00 gal. I now have it in my vulcan, and am very pleased with it. This whole issue will drive you nuts, if you let it. But I am happy with my choice.

 

[boraticus]

"This whole issue will drive you nuts, if you let it."

You are correct.

You've chosen a very good product and rest assured that it will be more than satisfactory for your motorcycle. There's no need to spend big bucks on exotic oils for street bikes. Any decent HDEO or synthetic of the correct viscosity will do the job effectively.

I'd like to know the last time anyone on this forum heard of a motorcycle blowing up due to the type or brand of oil used in it's engine?