Agip 4T shears a lot

[Jellyrug]

Hello, I posted and it was suggested that I repost here.

I used Agip 4T full synthetic on a Husky enduro bike, as per manufacturers recommendation, 10W60.

From my UOA after 1000 miles, it sheared down to a viscosity of 13 cSt at 100C.

Also used their 5W40 on a Suzuki Hayabusa, after 1,200 miles it sheared down to 10 cSt at 100C.

To me it looks as if the stay in grade properties are poor, for this expensive oil. Any opinions?

 

[sunruh]

i would want to see more than just the shear numbers, but from 21.9 (min for 60wt) to 13 is a pretty big drop!

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Jellyrug
Hello, I posted and it was suggested that I repost here.


Not here.

I meant here:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=9&page=1

 

[Jellyrug]

Husqvarna TE610

2008

OIL TYPE & GRADE: AGIP T4 10W60
OIL USE INTERVAL: 1,101

Willem: The wear metals found in this first sample from the 600cc four-stroke engine in your enduro bike
are at pretty normal levels for a new engine during wear-in. Copper is from brass / bronze parts, which are
run on a lathe and do not receive a finish polish at the factory, so copper is usually the last metal to finish
wearing in. The viscosity was low for a 10W/60 oil, but the fuel at just 1.3% is not enough to lower the
viscosity, so we will monitor both next time. Check back at your next oil change to monitor. You should find
some nice improvements.

Miles on unit 1,701
Sample date 8/21/10
Make up oil 0
Aluminum 30
Chromium 1
Iron 57
Copper 150
Lead 9
Molybdenum 1
Nickel 2
Manganese 3
Silver 13
Titanium 0
Potassium 7
Boron 162
Silicon 7
Sodium 10
Calcium 2522
Magnesium 273
Phosphorus 933
Zinc 1226
Barium 2
SUS Viscosity @ 210F 70.5
cSt Viscosity@100 13.09
Flashoint F 370
Fuel % 1.3
Antifreeze 0
Water 0
Insolubles % 0.3

 

[sunruh]

gotta love the stoners comments.

where is the comment about silver being at 13?

truely where is it?
i want to hear them explain what parts have silver in them.

you needed to change this oil about 1000 miles sooner.

1.3% fuel is not good. was the oil drained cold or hot?

for 1100mi the aluminum is pretty low actually. the iron about where i would expect. copper is making me wonder if you have ANY of the sleave left in that clutch hub or not.
silicon of 7 seems impossible on a dirtbike with 1100mi on it
was it ever ridden in the dirt or is this a motard?

 

[Jellyrug]

About the silver, I sent three samples at the same time, one was for a 09 Suzuki Hayabusa. There they did mention the silver and said they never seen this before, asked if I had any idea where it came from.

Oil was drained hot.

The Husqvarna TE610ie is a street legal dirt bike. Ridden about 80% pavement and 20% off road for the miles considered.

Fuel dilution could be lots of short little trips and not riding the bike much.

 

[sunruh]

20% offroad is 220miles in the dirt. a silicon of 7 seems impossible. did you only ride alone and in the mud for all 220mi?

honestly, even though the oil is almost 3 grades down your report isnt all that bad. sure copper is high and silver is unexplainable, but the rest is pretty low for the mileage. i wonder what the susvis would show if you had under 0.5% fuel. probably still in the 40wt range i would guess.

 

[Jellyrug]

Thx

No mud, only dirt, calculation seems OK. I'm old as dirt, so when I ride in the dirt there is losts of dust, as everyone else is ahead of me. After that everything that works, hurts.

I take care of my air filter, by putting some nice spectro oil in there and clean it after riding in the dirt.

The three samples I sent was 5W40 in a Hayabusa, viscosity dropped down to 10 cSt after 1,200 miles, no fuel dilution. Silver was present as well. The Husky sample I posted. Then there was a Harley factory fill sample, held it's viscosity very nice, no silver.

It is possible that the silver comes from Agip in the oil.

I replaced the Harley oil with Agip 10W60 as well and it is due for a change, 2,000 miles on the oil. Will be interesting to see what gives.

 

[ccdhowell]

Earlier this year I sent in virgin samples on two of Agip's moto oils, the 5w40 and 20w50. They're not the same as the one you ran, but neither of them showed any trace of silver, FWIW here's the VOAs.

5w40

20w50

 

[sunruh]

so if the 10w60 is similar to the 5w40 and 20w50 then you would think it has no silver in it (and why would it?) and silicon of 4 for anti-foaming. which means in 1100 miles you only added 3ppm of silicon to your sample. which is as good or better than any car filtration! beyond awesome to say the least!

i think the copper is from the sleave in the clutch hub and is taking some abuse from the pavement miles, but should hopefully be up to the task.

had it started life as a 40wt this would be one heck of a good report. yes it sheared from 60wt to low 40wt. in this case, its no big deal. especially in the summer. i would bet it fell out of the 60wt range pretty fast.

i dont know the price on this oil, but you got some serious miles out of it.

depending on the price per mile i would consider a switch to Shell Rotella T 15w40 (SRT) that you can get for $11gal or less at wallyworld and run for 250mi.

 

[Jellyrug]

I believe the 20W50 is a double Ester, it also shows in the price. The 5W40 and 10W60, some say it is PAO base, others say it is Base III. Who knows, looks like it is imported from Italy, so I would like to believe it is a full synthetic.

The stay in grade of both the latter two is poor though.

The silver we saw, could be silver plating in needle roller bearings on both the Hayabusa and the Husky. The Harley showed none.

I'm onto Silkolene next, will see if it beats the AGIP with stay in grade proeprties.

 

[sunruh]

silkolene is the one brand i have not tried. its price gives me no reason to try it when there are other very viable products to choose from at 1/3 - 1/5th the cost.

as for the silver on needle bearings. maybe, maybe not. could it be the oil is not doing a good enough job and therefore the needle bearings are suffering? thus sheading 13ppm. another uoa of the same mileage might prove it. or not.