What is going on here?!!

[MaDMaXX]

Forgive my somewhat brash introduction but oil and filters have been driving me nuts since i moved to the states recently.


Googling around over the years and more recently, has turned up various lists and articles on good and bad oil filters (lets not even start on oils) However, having read some of the posts in here, half the stuff i've found (a lot of it correlating as well) seems to be wrong.

Let me explain;

Fram filters - I found these used to be good but now are made with sticky-back plastic and cotton buds.

Yet several posts in here state otherwise.....


Bosch filters, i just took a couple back to Autozone and swapped for Mobil 1 because they were the next "cheapest"


Now don't get me wrong, the Mobil 1 filters work out the same price as a normal good filter in the UK, but why am i now seeing Bosch filters being heralded as superb from Champ labs, whom i read made mostly [censored] filters for parts stores and walmart? (i know they made good ones for other brands as well)


Do we have/maintain a good/bad filter list here at all?

What happened, was all the data i found out of date? I should of rememembered i was registered here tbh

Here's an example of one of the things i found which made me take the Bosch back too.

http://www.efficient-mileage.com/oil-filters.html


Any enlightenment would make my day.

Thanks.

 

[chubbs1]

You ain't gonna find it here. I posted something today and I got back one message that said "'Bob' who started this site didn't use a filter and his truck was fine."

People seem to think the filters aren't important anymore, yet engines are getting less and less forgiving tolerance-wise at the least. Filtration has to make a difference. I was frustrated today with that post.

 

[Spector]

I am one of those proponents of filters being a useless appendage except for catastrophic failure (and the filter can contribute to that as well) My own personal test two OCIs, changing filter at 7500 in a 15,000 mile OCI and not changing it resulted in no changes in the UOA. So in a well operating engine IMO we certainly change them out way too often. Modern oils and engines IMO, do not require changing the filter every oil change. No huge database of info to back it up just years of changing the stupid things out

 

[Sayjac]

First, I'm not going to debate whether a filter is important/necessary or not. I have to use one, so I want to get the best construction/filtration I can get for the least money, value in other words. For me, Purolator products generally fit that definition.

Much of the information in your linked post is not current. Taking the Bosch Prem filters back based on that one article was a mistake, IMO. The Bosch Prem., now made by Purolator is virtually identical to a Pure One. A fine filter and a good value, IMO.

Have to also say, though I don't use Wix, that may be the first opinion piece I've read saying to avoid Wix filters. Wix is generally highly regarded here. I'd say they are a well made filter with good filtration.

If you want to read some more current filter information done by one of our members you should review in the link below. Besides dissection, it also contains some actual testing. http://filtrationcomparisons.weebly.com/
If you want to read the whole thread which lead to the previous summary you can find it here. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1616368&page=1

 

[Spyder7]

I consider it all part of the same system: lubrication. I place more importance on the filter than I do on the oil: with oil there are many good choices out there, both dino and syn, and I go from one to the other and back. As long as the oil is decent value I buy it, as the best bang for the buck oil varies from one week to the next. The OCI is then decided accordingly, and factors into the equation too.

Filters I change independently. My current choice is based on a 10k cycle (engine is on a cleaning cycle), with a couple k worth of buffer thrown in if its not convenient to change it until I'm closer to 12k than to 10k.

Filter prices, at least here, are pretty consistent and there's not much to be had locally in terms of variety or sale. Given the choices here, prices, and what I expect from the filter, this one is the choice that made sense to me (in sig) and went with.

YMMV. Polling about filter preference is about as useful, and productive, as polling for color preference. Everyone has different criteria, places different weight on it, and has a different selection at different price points to pick from.

There is useful, factual data to be found. You just to dig to find it, and weigh it all accordingly.

-Spyder

 

[Familyguy]

Other than the "avoid Fram" mantra, the article referenced by the OP is full of dubious advice. I like the slam on Wix filters. LOL

 

[eljefino]

Quote:

Start by picking out the oil filter referenced by the guy at the desk. Then pick out a bunch of other oil filters in larger boxes. Look at the O-ring gasket. Find a few oil filters that match the O-ring gasket diameter and appear to have a similar threading. Buy all of the ones that potentially fit. When you're under the car later that day, dry-fit the various filters. Keep the largest one that fits. Take back the rest that don't. If they all fail, you'll still have the oil filter the parts guy referenced so the trip won't be a complete loss.


What a tool. First the parts store isn't going to take back filters that have oil on them from dry fitting on the block. Secondly they'd laugh pretty hard about you buying every filter on the shelf to "see what fits" when they have the book right there. Third, his method doesn't account for bypass PSI, ADBV or anything else.

Secondly, wixfilters.com has all the info you need to cross reference. Even if you only look up your thread pitch, you could sneak a bolt in, (3x4 x 16 being mine) and try it out in the store.

 

[Ibrahim]

I will update the list of the current Top of the line Oil Filters in North America widely available at auto (car & truck) shops and dealers...

*Not in any raking order!!!

------------Best Oil Filters------------
Amsoil
Baldwin
Bosch Distance Plus
BOSCH OEM (Euro Cars Only)
Donaldson
Fram Xtended Guard
Fleetguard
Hastings
Heingst
K&N
Luber Finer
Mahle
Mann+Hummel
Mobil 1 Extended Performance
NAPA GOLD
Purolator Pure One
Royal Purple
WIX




* Please feel free to rank them according to overall performance...

 

[Sayjac]

Your list leaves out the Bosch Premium filter which as I said earlier is, excluding the can, is the same as a Pure One. I would include them.

As for ranking them, it would/could depend on several factors like cost, OCI and miles driven per year. If other want to rank they can, I'll just say those are all quality filters from which to choose, and leave it at that. There are few less common, like Toyota TRD and Delco Ultra that are also not on the list.

And for the OP a couple more comments. For your title what is going on here?? My answer would be, what's going here, the Bitog oil filter board, is much more accurate than what's going on in your posted link or some google info (unless it leads here). You may have to sort through some of the information here, read and decide for yourself what's best for your situation, cost, OCI, etc., but it's here.

No offense intended but I guess I'd say the better question is, what's going on in your link? It appears a lot of outdated and some very questionable, dubious information.

 

[endeavor to persevere]

This list is a little out-dated but fairly close... you get the picture


Fram-Honeywell

Fram Extra Guard (std)
Fram Tough Guard (different media?)
Fram X2 (Silicone ADBV, Fuzzy media)
Fram Extended Guard(same as the X2)
Mileguard (Jiffy)
Honda (although some are alleged to be made by Filtech)
Chrysler line up except for the Cummins
Pennzoil
Deffense
Canadian Tire
Orielly's

Champion Labs

Car and Driver
Deutsch
Mobil 1
STP
SuperTech
K&N
Valvoline filters
Mighty
Service Champ
Lee
AutoZone Value Craft
AC Delco
VW (some)
Warner
Luberfiner
Trust
Royal Purple

Wix

Carquest blue
Carquest red
Napa Gold
Napa Silver (lower quality with nitrile ADBV)
Kralinator (in Canada)
ALLIANCE (Freightliner aftermarket)

Purolator- Bosch/Mann Group

Bosch
premium plus (nitrile adbv)
Purolator Pure One (silicone adbv, different media)
Havoline
Maxlife Valvoline (some)
Group7
Promotive
Powerflow
Quaker State (less media)
Advanced Auto Total Grip. (less media)
Pep Boys Pro Line
MotorCraft
Superflo

Denso

Toyota

Mann+Hummel

Mann
Volvo

Clarcor

Baldwin
Hastings
Amsoil
Casite

 

[Y_K]

A lot of what you find on internet is based on hearsay, herd mentality and utter lack of thought. Lack of knowledge would be too deep. There are various and frequently opposing schools, e.g. filter caking helps as long as the construction is durable enough vs best filtration available with filter swap half-way or so through the ODI. It all may be valid as it all depends. The only proven advantage is demonstrated by bypass filtration which by its nature is head and shoulders above single inflow filtration. It is not always feasible or needed. Hence the room for creativity and entertainment. For example: misquoting an 'authority' like this - just transpose onto motor oil filtration

"...beware of mathematicians and all those who
make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that mathematicians
have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and confine
man in the bonds of He_ll." -- St. Augustine

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
Any enlightenment would make my day.



Buy based on time/miles in service. The price should correspond accordingly. Using a top tier filter where you're refreshing the sump often enough is a waste ..unless you're willing to use the filter over more than one oil change interval. It gains you no benefit that will result in significant difference in engine life.

 

[MaDMaXX]

A lot of good and interesting advice in here, thanks.


The list at the end of the first page, that just seems like a fill list of all oil filters, rather than of good ones, right?


The article i linked was, as i said, fairly supportive of similar views around the web. Things like Bosch being linked by a better manufacturer seems to of turned around the recommendations.

The trouble with sites/places that show/list/test all this info is they tend not to be updated nor dated, so short of looking at the website design/coding, it's hard to determine the age of the article.

This forum however, obviously much more current, people seem to be opening filters all the time and staying roughly on top of things. Not mentioning the can of worms opened by people not changing them at all/not changing them for more than one change/not bothered about the filter due to regular change etc.


Anyway, i think i have a better reference on things now so i thank you all. The Bosch filter, i'll have to check the version, but it seems that would be a good one to buy from Autozone as it's half the price of the Mobil1 version.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: MaDMaXX
Forgi
Now don't get me wrong, the Mobil 1 filters work out the same price as a normal good filter in the UK, but why am i now seeing Bosch filters being heralded as superb from Champ labs, whom i read made mostly [censored] filters for parts stores and walmart? (i know they made good ones for other brands as well)


Bosch filters are NOT made by Champ Labs.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: MaDMaXX
Now don't get me wrong, the Mobil 1 filters work out the same price as a normal good filter in the UK, but why am i now seeing Bosch filters being heralded as superb from Champ labs, whom i read made mostly [censored] filters for parts stores and walmart? (i know they made good ones for other brands as well)


As others have pointed out, American Bosch filters are made by Purolator and they're a fine filter. They will not, however, be the same filters as encountered in Europe for European applications (for the UK, I cannot say).

My advice when it comes to filters is always pretty basic. First, when in doubt, buy OEM, assuming it's not triple the price of anything else. Aside from that, pick a filter from a reputable manufacturer and go with whatever is reasonably priced.

All my vehicles have quality oil filters available for $5 and under. So, I'm simply not going to spend $12 for an oil filter, no matter what the filter manufacturer promises me.

 

[motorguy222]

There is also Affinia,the parent company of WIX.Affinia,I would say,really WIX,makes filters for some parts houses for a house brand.One being Auto Value Auto Parts under their parts name,Parts Master.These may be an ok filter with some differences from the WIX such as a nitrile anti-drain back valve and some difference in element size,shape and or construction.Still they are probably a good filter.The element may be kind of brittle when the filter is cut open but according to some on the board,that is nothing to really worry about.

 

[OVERKILL]

I thought this part was pure gold:

Quote:
Photo Top Left: A chip on the top of the crankshaft lobe is clearly visible. This chip was probably caused by natural oil. The natural oil clogged the lash adjusters that resulted in a greater force being applied to the camshaft lobe. The natural oil cannot deal with such forces since it is limited to a compressional strength of about 300psi. The hardened surface of the camshaft is what gave way.


I literally LOL'd.

Given some of the crud I've found in my oil filters on a healthy engine, I regard them as a very important component. I also don't regard UOA's as a very good tool for determining engine wear (aside from giving notice of a potential component issue or failure, as per the article on the front page on this site about them kindly provided by Doug). So performing a UOA on an engine with and without an oil filter resulting in very little variation in the UOA results.... Hardly conclusive for me. A test not designed to measure wear being used to measure wear?

Were the insoluble levels higher? Was a particle count performed?

I'd rather not have this stuff surfing around my crankcase:

That came out of one of those "unimportant" oil filters.

 

[Ibrahim]

Madmaxx, I listed many top of the line Oil filters in my previous post, if not basically all of them...

But as another member said, it all depends, on your intended Oil change interval? whats is your preference More Flow or More Filtration? your application and purpose?...and of course the limit of your budget?

If you tell us about the Cars you have and the intended OCI you are planning to do and whether or not money will be factor?

Than many members will be able to suggest you accordingly...

 

[MaDMaXX]

All posts/comments appreciated, thanks all.

My preference is to stop the [censored] staying in my oil, i'm covering cars such as my own 2001 Mustang, to my Wife's 97 Accord, to my friends Accords and Elements.

Cost isn't *really* as issue, as if i need to, i will spend the $13 on a Mobil1, but if the Bosch's are all the same over here, i'd rather put that on at half the price.

Um, OCI? Oil change intervals, 3-5000k miles.

 

[Bottom_Feeder]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Bosch filters are NOT made by Champ Labs.

Well, not anymore, they aren't. Not for many years.

That page is full of misinformation and personal opinions stated as if they were facts. I suggest to the OP to never ever go there again.