Using NON-Honda ATF in an Accord (successfully)

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Well, this should stir up some "hate mail" and death threats!!.... and probably some positive comments too!

After a LOT of digging around, research, reading lots of posts on here, talking to major oil company tech support dept's. and several professional mechanics, I decided to
( GASP! ) put NON-Honda ATF in our '05 Accord. I could not find any hard or finite, DOCUMENTED evidence that not using Honda ATF-Z1 (assuming it meets Dexron III, which is "tentatively approved" in the Accord Owner's Manual) has factually damaged any transmissions in Honda's or Accura's. LOTS of "opinions" but NO documentation.

Local Honda dealers want $9.30 a quart for ATF-Z1, which is ludicrous. Further, I have concluded that Honda ATF-Z1 is
not anything special quality wise and probably gets a C- as an ATF. I did not want to go to a synthetic as there can be risk of issues there, so I went to a local commercial oil dealer and bought a case of Shell "Multi-vehicle" ATF and did three changes for a complete fluid exchange.

SO FAR, after a week of normal driving, I can tell absolutely no difference of any kind, in the way the transmission shifts, speed of shifts, etc. So, I do know at this point that there is initially no problem. My gut feeling is that the main "product benefit" of Honda ATF-Z1 is to the local Honda dealer's profit. I also noted in the Accord owner's manual that they esentially say the same thing about ANY fluid: > (Bet the marketing dept. wrote all those blurbs in the manual!)

OK....I can take it!......let the flamming begin!!

Best Regards....
 
I have no doubt that your Accord's transmission will last another 150,000+ miles. The main thing is to change the fluid; I suspect the marketing department had alot to do with the "Honda-only" tranny fluid. Nothing will cook a transmission faster than old, dirty fluid. Good job!
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Meanwhile...
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Oh, and by the way
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to BITOG!
 
I see no problem in using another brand if it meets the spec.
However i am an engine man and know very little about transmissions..
What i do know from talking to many transmission guys is that honda transmissions keep them in business one says his two favorite cars are Honda and Chrysler because they keep him in business
 
I agree with you. I've used Amsoil ATF in my '05 V6 Accord for a year now (30K miles) and the transmission shifts better than with the Z1 ATF. Also the fluid still looks and smells new. The Z1 seemed to turn brown and smell rather quickly IMO.
 
OMG! I CANNOT BELIEVE THAT YOU WOULD RISK YOUR TRANSMISSION IN SUCH A WAY! *GASP!*

WHAT WERE YOU THINKING?

YOU HONDA HATER

hum...

THAT SHELL STUFF DOESN'T BELONG IN YOUR HONDA

err. lets see... what else... oh yeah

YOU DON'T DESERVE THAT CAR!

how's that?
 
I don't pay much attention about oil, dino or syn, as long as it is SL or newer, Lexus needs SG, MB and Honda needs SL. But I only use ATF recommended (or newer) in the manuals, the reason is I only change ATF every 6-8 years or 80-100k miles. If the cost is $4-5 extra per quart and my MB needs 8 quarts, the extra cost per thousand miles of driving, about a month, is only 4-5 pennies.

If you are changing ATF every 10k miles or so, then saving $4-5 a quart is something to consider.
 
Originally Posted By: RC46_Rider
I went to a local commercial oil dealer and bought a case of Shell "Multi-vehicle" ATF and did three changes for a complete fluid exchange.

How much did the Shell fluid cost you per quart?

When I did a 3x drain/fill of our VUE's transmission at 30K miles I stuck with Z1 but I only paid $4.50/quart.
 
I did a 6qt drain and fill on my 2008 Honda Odyssey's trans with Valvoline Maxlife ATF about a year ago. I'll do another 6qt drain/fill before winter. No issues what so ever. In fact, the trans has behaved better ever since. Less fluttering in/out of lockup and less erratic shifts.

Joel
 
I agree with you that Honda Z-1 is nothing special even though it's all I've ever used in my Accord. I bought a case of Z-1 with a $100 Gift Card (for the Parts Dept.) that my selling dealer sent me (that's why I use it).
I've D&R'd it approx. every 20K along with adding LG Red and a Magnafine inorder to help my trouble-prone BAXA A/T along. So far so good, as I have 104K on the original A/T and it's running fine.

Now that my free Z-1 is gone I'll be using Castrol Import, Valvoline Maxlife, Wolf's Head Universal or maybe even Redline D4. Good for You and thanks for sharing your experience.
 
No flaming here, lots of Bitoger prefer other than Z-1, and many more really dislike Z-1. So no shocker here for me. Many like Amsoil.

Now as for your choice, if I were going to use a multi-vehicle atf, it would be one meeeting the Asian spec(s) rather than the Shell Domestic spec you chose. Just me.

That said, I've used only Z-1 in an 01 Civic (infamous trans) since new with 145k+ miles with 4 simple drain and refills, and no issues. I have paid ~$6.50 a qt and it only requires 3. I get a price match from the cheapest dealer, sometimes I've fudged the quote a tad.
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But you're right, I wouldn't pay $9.30 qt. either.

What year and model Honda is it? How many miles on the car, and miles using other than Z-1?
 
The main issue in my mind is that there is VERY limited data for this stuff being OK/the same as/better than the Honda ATF over 150k of continuous use.

Hondas also have been known to have issues with ATs, including civics, accords, etc. The Honda AT design is different than other designs.

ATs are the one place where I always recommend the OE specified fluid. What is the savings over the lifecycle of the car? $100?
 
Wow! Thanks for the quick responses....didn't expect that.

Candidly, one of the reasons I decided to switch brands of ATF fluid is because we also have an '04 Civic (140K on it), and I have regularly (~ 35k) changed the tranny fluid in that with the Honda ATF-Z1 and it comes out really bad looking for that kind of mileage. Brown and almost burnt looking; looks like hammered dog feces for only 35K. There is also a lot of "iron fuzz" on the drain plug magnet. Certainly, not impressive wear protection by any means. I would LOVE to see someone do some serious ASTM tests on some of these ATF fluids.
Fortunately, Accords and Civics are easy to do a fluid change on, which is a good thing since from this point forward, I will be changing ATF more often.

Someone asked about the mileage on the Accord that I put the
Shell ATF in; it has 70K on it.

I paid $3.36 a quart for the Shell Multi-Vehicle ATF.

From what I have seen and read, I would STRONGLY suggest to
Honda owners to change tranny fluid much sooner than Honda
recommends.

Thanks for the comments.

Regards......
 
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Originally Posted By: JTK
I did a 6qt drain and fill on my 2008 Honda Odyssey's trans with Valvoline Maxlife ATF about a year ago. I'll do another 6qt drain/fill before winter. No issues what so ever. In fact, the trans has behaved better ever since. Less fluttering in/out of lockup and less erratic shifts.

Joel


If I'm not mistaken there is a transmission recall (for programming) for this issue. I haven't taken ours in yet, but we got a letter about it a while ago. You may also want to check into that.
 
Glad its working for you. I've been using Schaeffers ATF for 23,000 miles in the Corolla with no issues. Still looks and smells good too, unlike the T-IV I drained that had 30,000 on it. That was sort of purple and smelled like paint?
 
RC46_Rider, you should post this on a Honda forum, you'll probably get banned on the spot for such heresy
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Here we have more open minded folks probably because it's not a model specific forum.

While I don't have much experience with Honda AT's, my Mazda shifts great on multivehicle ATF's since I first flushed the transmission at around 15-20k miles, now running at 65k miles.
 
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Originally Posted By: unDummy
http://www-static.shell.com/static/can-en/downloads/shell_for_businesses/oils_lubricants/1-34.pdf

And its SOPUS sibling:
http://www.pennzoil.com/documents/Multivehicle ATF.pdf

And its competitor:
http://www.valvoline.com/pdf/Maxlife_ATF.pdf

If it works for you, stick with it and keep active with the maintenance intervals.





These PDS confirm what many have been saying lately....that the latest version of Maxlife is thinner. Apparently this was done inorder to meet the Dex VI spec.
I have heard many good things about using (the older, thicker) Maxlife in Honda A/T's but I personally would stick with something a bit thicker in a higher-mileage Honda A/T.
 
I'm using the "newer, thinner" MaxLife in our Honda tranny and so far so good. I've done two drain and fills on it and it's shifting smoother than it ever did on the Z-1. In fact, my first drain and fill was done at 20,000 miles and the Z-1 was NASTY! Brown and burned smelling.

I also think that Z-1 is nothing special!
 
i posted a long long time ago about doing this in my ex-wife's crv and my accord. accord got mobil 1 atf + lubeguard. did fine but lost 1 mpg. crv transmission started failing after an otherwise flawless life 6 months later. stuck in gear, refusal to upshift, slam-shifts under hard throttle, which was only partially resolved by flushing back to Z1. We sold the CRV shortly afterwards. CRV got an import multi fluid, don't recall if it was maxlife or castrol... but I HAVE been bitten by this so be careful and swap it out at the first sign of trouble.

I only use amsoil in the honda AT's now, and REALLY like it.

Mike
 
Originally Posted By: K20FA5
I'm using the "newer, thinner" MaxLife in our Honda tranny and so far so good. I've done two drain and fills on it and it's shifting smoother than it ever did on the Z-1. In fact, my first drain and fill was done at 20,000 miles and the Z-1 was NASTY! Brown and burned smelling.

I also think that Z-1 is nothing special!



The Maxlife should be fine in a 2009 but I'm probably going to put Castrol Import in my 2001 with over 100K because it is a little thicker.
 
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