Anti-Sludge Game Plan!

[Lethal1ty17]

So I have a 2001 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT (3.0L 6cyl). I got the car at 93,000 miles, no idea really on how well the previous owner(s) kept up the oil changes. It's currently at 120,000 miles. It has seen 2 or 3 OC's (cant remember) with 5w30 PP + Lucas oil stabilizer + PureOne filter. Currently has 5w30 Castrol Edge + PureOne with 5,900 on it so far. Loses about 1/2qt/5,000 miles and is maintained religiously.

The oil appears to be very clean for the amount of miles it has on it, this picture was taken at around 5,000 miles.

I dropped the oil pan and found this. There was a thin layer of sludge in the bottom of the pan, and a few slightly larger "clumps" of it that are visible if you look towards the top and bottom of the pan in the picture. I cleaned the sludge out and put it back on the car. Is this an acceptable/normal amount of sludge for a car with 120,000 miles on it? If not, what is?

On the inside of the crankcase I also found this. If you look on the left you can see small black spots which is sludge. Same question as above with the acceptable/normal amounts of sludge...

Now onto the top end of the engine:

Removed the valve cover and this is what I found. Everything seemed very clean, no sludge at all, just a brown varnish.

Now, I want to rid my engine of any and all sludge at all, because I intend on running this car into the ground, and the engine is the #1 thing to worry about in my mind.

I was thinking about doing an MMO treatment, however here are my concerns:

#1. After seeing these pictures and reading the info, is there even a point in trying the MMO in an engine that seems pretty clean already?

#2. MMO thins out the oil a bit, and the Ky heat + my spirited driving tell me that a thinner oil isnt a good thing here.

#3. I plan on using the Pennzoil Ultra oil for my next OC, and I would like to use it for 1 year/15,000 miles or whichever comes first. If I use the MMO now will I have any problems doing an extended OCI next or would it be best to do a shorter OCI afterwards to "flush" out any remaining MMO+sludge? I don't want to waste my precious Pennzoil Ultra nectar of life, or money for that matter.

#4. How much MMO would you guys recommend given my spirited driving/daily heat/sludge buildup, and for how long?

#5. I know now, after reading a lot on BITOG that the Lucas oil stabilizer is junk and not highly regarded, is there a chance that it made more sludge in the 20,000 miles that I ran it? I never really had any problems with it.

Thanks!

 

[demarpaint]

First off, stop using the Lucas oil Stabilizer.

As far as MMO is concerned, I have used it countless times during the summer. If you are a first time user and are concerned with the heat let me make this suggestion. Pick your favorite oil, use it, then add a pint of MMO for the last 1000 miles of your OCI. Do that until the winter, then during the colder winter months replace 1 qt of oil with 1 qt of MMO and run the full OCI with it.

You have some sludge/varnish, MMO will clean it up using it as I suggested above. It will take some time, but fear not!

 

[Lethal1ty17]

I stopped using the oil stabilizer as of about 7 months ago when I last changed the oil, it just has the Edge 5w30 in it now.

I was kind of hoping that I could do a MMO flush just once to get most of the major stuff out, then let the Pennzoil Ultra get whatever was remaining but it sounds like it takes a good while to clean out the sludge...

I guess I'll go buy some MMO on my way into town right now and just top it off. Don't feel like draining some out at the moment.

 

[demarpaint]

I've been over filled by half a qt on a 4.5 qt sump. Not sure on the size of your sump but a pint overfilled is not a problem in engines 4.5qts and up.

MMO is not a fast flush, if you are looing for a faster way of cleaning an engine, try Kreen. The company that makes it is solid, I've used Kroil and think it is a fantastic product. I would have no problem giving Kreen a shot! Check it out here:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1940735#Post1940735

HTH

 

[RF Overlord]

Dude, I'm not sure why you're even concerned at all. For 120,000 miles, that motor looks impressively clean. Put it back together and have fun with it...

 

[Jakegday]

dang, i wish my oil pan was that easy to get to!

 

[Bluestream]

Your engine is fine, no need to obsess about sludge

 

[gathermewool]

I'd suggest using oil and oil only, no MMO. Small amounts of sludge in the pan is not indicative of a sludged up motor. IMO, the sludge that is in there is due to PO running his OCI's a little long occasionally. Regardless, I'd suggest running a Ultra (or what ever you choose) and, after the second interval, send out an analysis to determine the TBN and other physical properties of the oil to ensure that neither your oil or interval will contribute to sludge in the future.

 

[SrDriver]

I would not run the oil for that many miles no matter what kind you use. I would not do more than 5000 to 7500 miles on it. It will offer cleaning and you can stretch out the life of the vehicle.

I have used MMO with good results both in the gasoline and oil and agree 100% about the post above regarding it.

 

[addyguy]

You don't have a sludge problem in your engine, bud.

Your oilpan is painted black, or is black metal, on the inside. You have an oil film on it, not a build-up of sludge!

You oil pick-up is completely clean, not one bit of grit in it, and your valvetrain is very, very clean.

You're obsessing over absolutely nothing - just change your oil at reasonable intervals, and keep going.

I love the way people on this site DESPARATELY want there to be sludge problem with their engine, so they can 'clean it out'!

 

[bepperb]

Agreed, that engine looks fine to me. That's the varnish I would expect with 120,000 miles.

 

[KrisZ]

If you're looking for a problem, you will eventually find one, I see no sludge in this engine, I would rather see compression test readings, that's a true indicatior of engine's health, not little bit of varnish.

 

[daman]

Ya looks good to me,i see there's a M1 jug in the one pic use that or PP/PU and you should stay clean.

 

[Lethal1ty17]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I've been over filled by half a qt on a 4.5 qt sump. Not sure on the size of your sump but a pint overfilled is not a problem in engines 4.5qts and up.

it's 4.5qt, so i'll just add between 8 and 16oz

Originally Posted By: addyguy
Your oilpan is painted black, or is black metal, on the inside. You have an oil film on it, not a build-up of sludge!



i know its painted black but i circled the clumps in red so you can see them better.

Originally Posted By: KrisZ
I would rather see compression test readings, that's a true indicatior of engine's health, not little bit of varnish.


while i do not have a compression guage, i just changed the timing belt and when i was cranking it over by hand with a ratchet, it just about killed me to get it past a compression stroke

Originally Posted By: daman
Ya looks good to me,i see there's a M1 jug in the one pic use that or PP/PU and you should stay clean.

M1 jug was from my moms honda and is just what i used to drain it into. but i did stock up using my $5 off coupon. should be good for the next year.

not really obsessing about it, i just like knowing that there will be zero sludge in my engine.

 

[daman]

All great products in that pic.

 

[Bluestream]

My Explorer was a Ford lease return. I suspect it was not well looked after as it had sludge build up in the valve covers after three years of use. I could find evidence of only one oil change during 66,000 Miles. I bought it anyway because it was priced low and ran well, also, my wife liked the color. I started regular oil changes with dino oil, and today 7 years later the sludge is almost all gone. Motor still runs great now at 144,000 Miles.

You engine looks like almost new.

 

[badtlc]

it would be cool to see you run the MMO and check back later to see if any of the varnish gets removed or not. I don't think you need it, though.

 

[Steve S]

I looks great. just change the oil at proper intervals.

 

[Steve S]

The amount of deposits in your engine they are not worth worrying about. look at the pickup screen and the top end . Spotless . Sludge only matters when there is enough to clog the pickup screen or block oil returns.

 

[97tbird]

Lubeguard oil flush is one of the more gentle ones available, and has a decent reputation... I like to use it once a year or so, just for the peace of mind..it's one of those things you can try without fear of harm, even if it's not essential.