Lubricant recomendation Mazdaspeed 3

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FreeFlyFreak

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I have a mazdaspeed 3 (mazda 3 2.3 turbo) and am most confused as to what is the best tranny fluid to use.

The tranny is a six speed AFAIK an Aisin six speed Bg6:
http://www.aisin-ai.co.jp/english/products/ff.html

It has syncros and a "cone type" LSD whatever that means.

Any way from what I have read LSD's and syncros are a tough pair to match with a fluid.

My owners manual calls for GL-4 75W90
The new 2010 model MS3 (same box different ratios) calls for 75W80 GL4
Very different viscosity's.

So maybe you get my confusion.

Some comments I have read from owners of the same car are:

Quote:
Redline mt90 is a good choice but it causes a little lsd noise when its cold.

When i switched to mt-90 my car started to make humming noise when turning. I hate it. Next fluid change i am going back to stock.

My local speed shop was out of Redline MT-90 so I got the same weight Amsoil which was supposed to be "just as good". It's not. The Amsoil does not contain friction modifiers that the LSD needs. My LSD was making a loud "whah-whah" noise when I made sharp turns. It took some research and to figure out the problem.

The MT-90 cured most of the LSD noise. Now it's only when the car is cold, and much quieter. I can live with it. But the MT-90 does not give the best shifting when the trans is cold. When the weather is cold (under 45) and the car is cold, 1-2 shifts are not happy.. there is some grinding for the first couple shifts. I can get around it by shifting to 3rd instead but that it clearly not right.

Ford makes a great fluid for the Mazdaspeed 3 and it is readily available at most Ford dealers. The part # is XT-M5-QS. It's made in Germany and the stuff is not cheap - I paid $19.25 a quart for it! Here's a link directly to Ford's chemical and lubricant site:
Full Synthetic Manual Transmission Fluid
If you can't go directly to the site, copy and paste it to your web browser.

I had big time problems with a cold weather 1-2 shift grind. I tried everything I could find in search of a solution. The best was Redline MTL which is a 70-80 wt mtf but it was clearly out of spec. The MTL was thin enough to allow better cold shifting but I was worried about wear with it being too thin. I ran it for about 9,000 miles before I discovered the XT-M5-QS. The MTL held up really well for being out of spec ( I was scared [censored] I'd find "silver soup" when I drained it).

The XT-M5-QS transformed my Speed's shifting! It shifts [censored] near like a Honda and grinds of any kind are a thing of the past. I also have zero noise from the LSD or anything else for that matter. Take the time to google XT-M5-QS and I think you'll find it is the best kept secret in all of transmissiondom.


So I am leaning toward the Ford stuff, but I am more than open to suggestions.
 
Last edited:
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to BITOG!


Originally Posted By: FreeFlyFreak
It has syncros and a "cone type" LSD whatever that means.

Any way from what I have read LSD's and syncros are a tough pair to match with a fluid.

I believe you have a helical differential -- actually a torque-biasing diff, not a limited slip, although most people (including some manufacturers) use "limited slip" for any non-open diff...

Anyway, the point is that your diff doesn't have a clutch pack to keep one wheel from spinning freely. It just has a gear setup that naturally causes more torque to go to the slower-spinning wheel.

I think that means it's easier to find a fluid for it, but don't take my word on that.


Originally Posted By: FreeFlyFreak
My owners manual calls for GL-4 75W90
The new 2010 model MS3 (same box different ratios) calls for 75W80 GL4
Very different viscosity's.

So maybe you get my confusion.

Is it possible they altered some of the bearing clearances, gear lash, etc.? Maybe the new car somehow cools the transaxle more effectively, enabling a lower viscosity grade.


Originally Posted By: FreeFlyFreak
Some comments I have read from owners of the same car are:

Quote:
Redline mt90 is a good choice but it causes a little lsd noise when its cold.

When i switched to mt-90 my car started to make humming noise when turning. I hate it. Next fluid change i am going back to stock.

My local speed shop was out of Redline MT-90 so I got the same weight Amsoil which was supposed to be "just as good". It's not. The Amsoil does not contain friction modifiers that the LSD needs. My LSD was making a loud "whah-whah" noise when I made sharp turns. It took some research and to figure out the problem.

The MT-90 cured most of the LSD noise. Now it's only when the car is cold, and much quieter. I can live with it. But the MT-90 does not give the best shifting when the trans is cold. When the weather is cold (under 45) and the car is cold, 1-2 shifts are not happy.. there is some grinding for the first couple shifts. I can get around it by shifting to 3rd instead but that it clearly not right.

Ford makes a great fluid for the Mazdaspeed 3 and it is readily available at most Ford dealers. The part # is XT-M5-QS. It's made in Germany and the stuff is not cheap - I paid $19.25 a quart for it! Here's a link directly to Ford's chemical and lubricant site:
Full Synthetic Manual Transmission Fluid
If you can't go directly to the site, copy and paste it to your web browser.

I had big time problems with a cold weather 1-2 shift grind. I tried everything I could find in search of a solution. The best was Redline MTL which is a 70-80 wt mtf but it was clearly out of spec. The MTL was thin enough to allow better cold shifting but I was worried about wear with it being too thin. I ran it for about 9,000 miles before I discovered the XT-M5-QS. The MTL held up really well for being out of spec ( I was scared [censored] I'd find "silver soup" when I drained it).

The XT-M5-QS transformed my Speed's shifting! It shifts [censored] near like a Honda and grinds of any kind are a thing of the past. I also have zero noise from the LSD or anything else for that matter. Take the time to google XT-M5-QS and I think you'll find it is the best kept secret in all of transmissiondom.


So I am leaning toward the Ford stuff, but I am more than open to suggestions.

Again, I may be wrong here, but I don't think helical diffs need friction modifiers the way clutch-type diffs do. That said, all transmission fluids have some friction modifiers in them for the synchros. You have to have just the right mix, combined with just the right viscosity. This is one reason why there are so many different kinds of transmission fluids. I strongly suspect that the noise and poor shifting properties with those other fluids wasn't because they lacked friction modifiers per se, but that they just had the wrong mix.

When you think about it, it wouldn't be too much of a surprise if the OEM fluid gave the best results.
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: d00df00d


When you think about it, it wouldn't be too much of a surprise if the OEM fluid gave the best results.
wink.gif



The problem is....... there is no OEM fluid, no Mazda recommended branded fluid, not specific anyway.
Just the 75w90 gl-4 vagueness from the manual,
 
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FreeFlyFreak,have no fear, XT-M5-QS is your answer! I have had this lube in my '08 Speed3 for 20k miles now with great results. It is pricey but you get what you pay for!
I paid $19 and change a quart for my oil at a Ford dealer but I have seen it online for around $15+ shipping. Get 4 quarts; the trannie holds a little over 3 quarts. I plan to change out the fluid when it has 40k miles on it - I doubt that it'll be anywhere worn out but there's always wear metals that I fret over.

Kinda funny that a full tilt boogie Mazda winds up needing a German manufactured oil to put out 100% of what it's got.

Cheers!
 
If your car's description says :
cone, clutch, friction, or spring, anywhere relating to the differential, you have a type that requires friction modification [slippery additive].

The pure gear type [Gleason Torsen] does not.
 
I have an 07 MS6. I have had awesome cold shifting with Amsoil MTF 75w90 in the tranny and SVG in the tcase and diff.
 
I just recently picked up a 10' MS3, and i'm almost done braking it in. I was thing about using Redling MT90, but after reading this i may just go with the Ford fluid. I can get it for just under $17. Now i just have to figure out the engine oil.
 
Originally Posted By: double vanos
FreeFlyFreak,have no fear, XT-M5-QS is your answer! I have had this lube in my '08 Speed3 for 20k miles now with great results. It is pricey but you get what you pay for!
I paid $19 and change a quart for my oil at a Ford dealer but I have seen it online for around $15+ shipping. Get 4 quarts; the trannie holds a little over 3 quarts. I plan to change out the fluid when it has 40k miles on it - I doubt that it'll be anywhere worn out but there's always wear metals that I fret over.

Kinda funny that a full tilt boogie Mazda winds up needing a German manufactured oil to put out 100% of what it's got.

Cheers!


I agree, in fact, I found that the XT-M5-QS oil improved shift action and cured any cold weather shifting issues. It's great stuff.
 
I've got the 2010 Mazdaspeed model, as mentioned above, the owner's manual says that this transmission requires SAE 75W 80 oil, which is different than the previous models ('06-09). It also says GL-4.
Which is more important- API or SAE? 75W-80 doesn't seem as common as 75W90. I was thinking of putting in this Motorcraft stuff but I don't want to cause any problems down the road as it is a 75W-90 but it IS a GL-4. Should I be matching both numbers, or is one more important than the other? I wouldn't care if not for any warranty issues Mazda might try to get out of.
Here's a link to the info on the Motorcraft stuff:
http://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.co...ion%20Fluid.pdf
 
Unfortunately our MazdaSpeed3 Manual says 75w80 which is almost impossible to find.

I'm in the same boat and the only Gear Oil that I can find, Synthetic or not, is Esso. I saw some reference to Redline on a UK website but the Redline website doesn't list 75w80, just 75w90.

Herein lies the problem. I'd love to put in what the manual says, I just can't find it.
 
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