38th ADAC Nurburgring 24hr Race

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Doug Hillary

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Hello,
I thought this may be of interesting to some

I am in Nurburg is Germany - at the Nurburgring. The 38th annual 24hr race is underway. some things that may be of interest

1 - Mobil1 0W-40 is the oil used by Porsche in their race cars - including the new Hybrid! It is an "off the shelf" version! This was confirmed by the Engineers from Weissach when I was in the Pits!

2 - A Daimler AG Protoype Engineer (Unterturkheim now at Sindelfingen) who is staying here with me (and a Mercedes Team complement) confirmed the fact that using the correct viscosity is the answer

3 - Castrol's EDGE RS 10W-60 (SL/CF) is quite popular with some Teams (VW-Audi privateers). Some Teams use a SAE30 variant and some use 15W-50 - synthetics rule!!

I hope this is of interest!
 
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Hi, Doug! Good to hear from you again, and thanks for the post.
cheers3.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hello,
I thought this may be of interesting to some

I am in Nurburg is Germany - at the Nurburgring. The 38th annual 24hr race is underway.

Holy Cow, Lucky Bast..!!!
That is so cool, hopes you have a lot of fun.

Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Some Teams use a SAE30 variant ...


Wow, thin oils as racing oils, that is interesting. I thought most racing cars use thicker oils.
Do you know which types of cars use this oil? And how are they doing in the race?
 
Hi Doug,

Hope you are having a great time, I know you are. If you have a chance, post a few pics from the great event.

Good to hear from you my friend.
 
Hi,
thanks for the comments - glad you find the comments interesting

Some Teams/Privateers are using Motul V300 (SAE60) but most couldn't care less about the brand - it is the viscosity that matters most to many. The Renault and VW (SEAT) guys I spoke with were using SAE30 but their events are short an d the weather is very cold - around 3-6C. The 10W-60 and 15W-50 viscosities are preferred in long distance events as fuel dilution intrudes

Porsche Privateers seem to prefer what the Factory uses or recommends with some settling on 15W-50. I should have more exposure in the next day or so. As one Engineer said to me last year, "most oils are excellent quality" etc etc "it is the viscosity that matters". This has been confirmed again here this year

I'll try to Post again but I don't return to Australia until mid June

AJ - Opel won this event in 2003 with an Astra V8 and the current models go very well in their Class. The 2003 win included a Driver (Tiemann) who has won here over the last four years in a Porsche 911 GT3
 
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Doug:

I wish I was there! Sounds like you are enjoying yourself, and if you have time, I would love to see some pictures!

-Chris
 
Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Opel won this event in 2003 with an Astra V8 and the current models go very well in their Class.



Was that the DTM version??

For that matter do ALL of the saloons/sedans have to run under DTM rules (or is there another class)?
 
Hi,
A little update from the Nurburgring. The main event started at 3pm today (it is 8pm as I write this)
And the Mathey GT3 RS and the R8 “favorite” are having a great battle! Only 19 hours left!

Some more lubricant information follows - I cannot add names to the people I mention for several reasons

These lubricants are the mainstay:
Castrol Edge RS 10W-60 and their TWS variant and Edge 0W-40 - the BMW “players” use these lubricants are quite common. I spent some time with a senior BMW Motorsport executive. He was very informative on many BMW issues

Some BMW racers use 10W-30 and/or 5W-40 viscosities. The French (Renault) racers use ELF of course and 15W-50 seemed to be popular along with 0W-40

Motul V300 is used by some racers and in a variety of engines - 15W-50 was the popular viscosity

I spent some time with a senior Aston Martin Engineer (German) who is based at their facility in Nurburg
He said that they use “off the shelf” M1 0W-40 and that is used in the cars racing here at the moment

Porsche racers seem to stay with Mobil 1 - as I said earlier many follow the Factory and use 0W-40 and others use 15W-40. None I met with used a 10W-60 lubricant

The heavily secretive Japanese Engineers told me that they use Motul V300 15W-50 in long range events

Opel’s facility at Nurburg has produced some excellent results for GM! Opel know what they are doing even if GM doesn’t!

It has been a real experience to have had access to so many high level persons here. My friend the Technical Director of the Porsche Museum was not able to be here. It was more than made up for by the free access given to me by Porsche Motorsport - at all levels

I spent some time with a young South African Driver Shane Williams. He was the winner of te SEAT event. He is a “VW” star so watch for him. He is intelligent and knowledgeable - motorbikes and Karts help!
Cross pollination of Technical knowledge and equipment between VM, SEAT, Audi and Skoda make for an interesting future. Combine this with Porsche now in the family and the VW Group’s star is shinning bright

Daimler AG’s linkage to the “French connection” with common floor pans and dispatite bodies assures it of a future in advance small cars

IMO there is no doubt that the Euro philosophies on car and engine design will see a spread of this into Asia, India and Africa

The DTM and this event are dissimilar. This event is multi class and a "Classic" sub event (3 hours duration)is also held
 
Hi,
an update
Porsche rules (this could be four in a row for this Team) with five hours to go. An Audi R8 is second two laps down

The Porsche GT3 Hybrid is still running well

What a great event!
 
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Hi,
yes m6pwr BMW wins with a Farnbacher Ferrari second and an Audi R8 third. The totally phenomenal No 1 Manthey Porsche was involved in a crash and the Manthey Porsche Hybrid had an technical incident and retired about an hour from the finish when in the lead! Minutes beforehand I had spoken with the Technical people and they informed me that the Hybrid had been totally troublefree - motorsport is a fickle passtime indeed

TWS rules and I'll complete the picture tomorrow. One little tidbit - some engines were using a 0W-20 lubricants from FUCHS and Castrol!
 
Doug Hillary said:
Hi,
These lubricants are the mainstay:
Castrol Edge RS 10W-60 and their TWS variant and Edge 0W-40 - the BMW “players” use these lubricants are quite common. I spent some time with a senior BMW Motorsport executive. He was very informative on many BMW issues

Some BMW racers use 10W-30 and/or 5W-40 viscosities. The French (Renault) racers use ELF of course and 15W-50 seemed to be popular along with 0W-40

Doug,
Surprised Castrol Edge 0W-40 is used....it is a low SAPS oil !
Click to expand...
 
1 - Mobil1 0W-40 is the oil used by Porsche in their race cars - including the new Hybrid! It is an "off the shelf" version! This was confirmed by the Engineers from Weissach when I was in the Pits!

I once called the Mobil hotline and was told that different countries have slightly different formulations for 0w-40 Mobil 1. This was in response to a question regarding slightly different labelling for the oil in Australia vs the USA and the extreme variability in pricing in US vs the world.
Does Europe/Australia get a different Mobil 1 vs the USA ?
 
Hi,
In the last day or so I have taken the opportunity to spend time with people who know lubricants
In the company of a Castrol Engineer I was able to understand a lot more about the issues Oil Companies face with DI engines and the attitude of the major engine Manufacturers

As mentioned earlier, Castrol’s TWS rules with many in long distance racing as I have said before (and after visiting here last year). This is the ‘ester” based version of their two 10W-60 viscosity products. The Edge RS 10W-60 (PAO) is also widely used - both these are SL/CF and ACEA A3/B3 compliant

It is interesting to note that in a number of real life power measurement experiments there was immeasurable difference between 0W-40 and 10W-60 once the engine was at full operating temperature

The winning BMW was on TWS

It is correct that some BMWs were raced here on FUCHS 0W-30 race oil - this product has no ACEA or API nomenclature

The R8 Audis were raced on TWS but their road cars must use 0W-40

The wonderful Opel OPC cars at 300hp from two litres use TWS - so do the VW Siroccos

Castrol’s gear lubricants that were first developed around 20 years ago are still judged to be at the top of the tree. This also applies to the double clutch gearbox variations on the Market in Europe. ATF development seems to be left with Mobil who have a great reputation in this area. Castol’s Transmax Z (ATF) is still a winner in its correct application but has not been developed in recent times

One litre containers of synthetic lubricants sell retail here at between 22Eu and 26Eu in Service Stns in rural (about 1 hour from Bonn) Germany

Mobil 1 0W-40 has a number of variants - many lubricants do - it is the specification that matters most!
 
Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
The wonderful Opel OPC cars at 300hp from two litres


That's naturally aspirated, right??

If so, then that sounds like the old Group A (road race & rally) powerplants with a little more development/tune levels.
wink.gif
 
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