Is Red Line the primo oil?

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No one mentioned esters competing with anti-wear additives as a reason for RL's poor UOA showing. Shell and XOM both claim this. Something to consider. Doesn't anyone else find it ironic that Shell uses Group III blends for their Ferrari F1 team?
 
It seems to me RL may be great oil to go with after an ARX cycle. I have a 1998 Camry 1MZ (3.0 V6) that is a know sludger. From what I've seen RL has low oxidation levels and is supposed to keep and engine from getting dirty. I'd love to see a valve cover shot of someone who has used it for a while..
 
Thanks for all the replies. My car (2005 Mustang GT) only has 14,000 miles, and has had M1 in it since 3000 miles. I doubt it needs cleaning at this point. Unless someone has a bad story to scare me off, I'm going to stick with Redline 5W-20, which is almost a 30 weight. I've previously been reluctant to use 5W-20, but have been convinced by all the glowing reports by all you guys here on BITOG. (OK, "thin" guys... welcome me aboard...) I gather that I should probably not try a UOA at the next change, but perhaps at the one after that?

I know cheaper oils will get me to 200k and beyond, but I don't just want to "get there". I want to be there with an engine which runs like new.
 
I found the best performance out of my motor with redline. It seems to build rpms faster faster turbo spool for sure and quiter all around cold and hot cooler under hood temps as well.
personally. It is expensive but after putting 3k in a 4cyl short block I want the best for the money and time I have put into it.
I feel redline is the best oil out there for clinging to the metal surfaces and stays put better than any oil out there. Its also very high quality easter based and keeps the motor spotless.
In a normal everyday stock vehicle it is a little over kill and is not needed but if you want to fork out the 9.00 a quart go a head.
Redline oils are darker and darken quickly in its cycle but should not be looked as bad just as its doing its job and will continue to keep the motor clean.
I have tryed alot of oils in this engine in its early life of 14k. mobil 1, royal purple, amsoil s2k and since I switched to redline the engine uses far less oil, under hoodtemps lower and faster spool on the redline. This was all on 10/30 (0/30 on the s2k). The engine just loves it the redline.
I feel there is not one best oil for every engine.
You just pick a good oil out there and see what happens. I like to give a new oil a chance for 5k so dont go off your fist impression of it.
 
427 I know you don't like Amsoil, but why do spend so much time telling the world?

Did you read my post? Didn't think so. Please restate what you wrote. You left out a few words.
 
Didn't I read here a few months back that the Red Line base oil combo now contains some PAO as well as the POE? I ran the search, but coundn't find the thread. I know that's a bit lame, but does anyone else recall this?
 
Thanks Pabs. I'll "refine" the search tomorrow. Incidentally, I emailed Redline myself earlier today and asked the base oil question. I'll see what I get and post if it's more than the usual marketing palaver.
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quote:

Originally posted by KBFXDLI:
Redline is the only group V synthetic oil on the market that I have heard of. Don't have any UOA's. But Amsoil & Mobil1 are Group IV which just aren't as good. Plus Redline is about the same price as Amsoil. Mobil1 is a little cheaper.

Respectfully, there are several problems with this statement. First, while it may be accurate as to KBF's actual knowledge, it's inaccurate otherwise. There are, as another poster noted, several brands on the market that make heavy use of G-V base oils. In addition, virtually none of the commercially available oils are purely composed of one base or another. Even RL contains PAOs in its mixes, so it's not a "pure" G-V, but also contains G-IV as well.

Second, you overgeneralize about Amsoil particularly. They make a wide range of products, including even a G-III line of oils (the XL series). The rest of their oils, most of the rest of the field, contain varying mixes of bases.

Third, what do you mean by "good"? If, for example, one factors cost into the "goodness" equation, then any "edge" enjoyed by the expensive syns rapidly fades away when you consider how well plain old dino SM oils have been performing, as indicated by our own UOAs. BTW, I use German Castrol, itself a G-IV&V combo, not dinos.

In the end, you just can't make sweeping statements like that -- not meaningful ones anyway. In a higher stress engine, a higher stress situation, etc., certain synthetics do justify their use. In other situations (some pretty common ones, btw), you'd be hard pressed
to find any data with which you could characterize any synthetic as "better", let alone G-V particularly. Remember, no oil is magic (well, maybe green GC...
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), and even G-V bases have their own set of disadvantages.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Pablo:
427 I know you don't like Amsoil, but why do spend so much time telling the world?

A little defensive aren't we Pabs? Find one post from me where I criticized Amsoil other than stating factual information. Further, in +4,000 posts, I believe I mentioned Amsoil maybe 4 times.

quote:

Originally posted by Pablo:
Did you read my post? Didn't think so. Please restate what you wrote. You left out a few words.

Yes I read your post. And no I didn't leave any words out in my posts. Did it ever occur to you that maybe I was interested in 5 qts of Amsoil Series 2K or 3K and I wanted to get an idea of what it would cost me?
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427 - If you want an idea of what something costs typically (according to the BiTOG rules) you don't go public and further you typically specify what product you are talking about. Your statement is simply incorrect about the majority of Amsoil's motor oils, it is public and I needed to set the set the record straight. I would have ZERO problem if:

You said "Comparing Amsoil catalog prices for S2K and S3K to Redline discount pricing, Redline is a relative price bargain."

Factual and true.

What is the Redline suggested retail price? What is the price of most of Amsoil's motor oils?
 
quote:

Originally posted by C.O. Jones:
IMHO, on paper, its the best I've seen, pure ester base and the VOA numbers are great.

(...SNIP...)


Red Line is predominantly POE, but according to onw of their own chemists, it does contain some PAO as well. Buster (Member 576) actually called them to discuss this, and has posted regarding this conversation on a number of occasions. Click here to see a recent example.

Buster, would you care to expound some on the details? I know you've done so before, but I think I would add to this thread.
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Sure. I was told that the "primary" basestock in RL is POE. Unlike M1/Amsoil which use PAO as the primary basestock (80% PAO to 15% ester approx.), RL uses majority POE. % unkown.

Now most on here have thought that this makes RL superior. In terms of friction and oxidation, it probably does, but not wear. After reading what Shell and XOM have found, I'd say it's not that simple to assume that bc RL uses more POE, it is therefore better. Molekule has recently said up to 50% POE is safe.
 
That's very interesting. If "only" up to 50% POE is safe, where does the %-age become critical, and how? If RL is majority POE (i.e. presumably more than 50%), then logically, their chemists must take a different view of the "safety limits" (assuming that they intend to sell a safe product, which of course they do).

After two years here, I've learned a lot, but alas, there are more mysteries than answers. It is pretty clear, however, that one simply can not make sweeping assumptions about oil quality, regardless of brand, just because of the type of base oil used in a given product.
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I think its that Redline base oil is a majority POE and if the base oil was about 80% of the total package, you still could have under 50% POE in the total package if a majority of the base oil is POE. But what about the other brands of ester oil that supposedly have more ester than Redline, such as Silkoline or Fuchs? Wonder how they perform.
 
Followers of Redline have a really big bag of excuses for its often lackluster UOA results; not that UOAs give tell-all info but still the excuses have gotten riduculous. I'd love to see Redline oils be used in API and ACEA engine tests. If it passed them, that would ease my fears that Redline is a haphazard mixture of expensive basestocks and lots of additives. I've used Redline oils before because I fell into the trap of reasoning that good ingredients must make a good meal; but the meal should be judged on its own. I'd be happy to become a follower of Redline oils, but I see no good reason to be and I see some reasons not to be.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Pablo:
427 - If you want an idea of what something costs typically (according to the BiTOG rules) you don't go public and further you typically specify what product you are talking about.

Interesting. I see people here "go public" and mention prices all the time. In fact, your first post in this thread YOU mentioned prices. Looking at the BITOG rules, the only one I spotted that remotely applies is from rule 8.) Members agree that, except with the owner’s prior consent, they shall not solicit or promote any products services or other sites by posting direct links of any sales pages of any products in this forum. I wasn't soliciting or promoting anything, which is why I chose the corporate website as not to promote any one person. And I did specify the product and quantity I was interested in.

quote:

Originally posted by Pablo:
Your statement is simply incorrect about the majority of Amsoil's motor oils, it is public and I needed to set the set the record straight. I would have ZERO problem if:

You said "Comparing Amsoil catalog prices for S2K and S3K to Redline discount pricing, Redline is a relative price bargain."

Factual and true.

What is the Redline suggested retail price? What is the price of most of Amsoil's motor oils?


I wasn't talking about a "majority of Amsoil's motor oils". I responded to your response of a particular Amsoil product vs the RedLine discussed here. As far as what is public, if I want to buy some RedLine, I can go to a local store and price it, or go to numerous websites to find the retail and website price, along with tax and shipping costs. Can I do the same with Amsoil? Far as I can tell, no, since the price you quote here, and what I can glean from the plethora of Amsoil websites is quite different. If you can't advertise the price you can sell it to me, fine, send me a PM. Until I see some type of firm price quote, I just consider it a PR job or a salesman bait and switch maneuver. So would you stop accusing me of hating Amsoil oils!! The two or three times a year I even ask a question about Amsoil you immediately go into the paranoid Amsoil salesman mode and get your panties in a bunch. Hint, you'll likely find I won't do business with such people nor recommend them to others.

To answer your questions:

RedLine suggested retail price, $8.75/qt.(Website)
Price of most of Amsoil's motor oils? Haven't a clue, since anytime I even ask a question about Amsoil, I'm attacked for hating them.
 
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