505.00 vs 505.01

[Fuzz1]

Can anyone highlight the difference in formulation and specs.

How do these specs compare to eg. API specs , especially CI4+ as well as ACEA spec such as B4-04 or B4-07.

I read that they are mutually exclusive and are not intercangeable.

I read on many forum that the 505.01 is far superior to the API CI4 spec and cant be used in high revving small capicity high output diesel engines.

 

[OilGuy]

VW specs are for different design challenges. Keep things simple and follow your owners manual. If it give you an option to use 505 00 or API, either is fine. If it says 505 01, use that or 507 00 approved oils that now supersede the older 505 01 spec.

 

[LoneRanger]

If you have a VW diesel w/ the Pumpe Deuse (unit injectors) engine (model yr 2004 - 2006) you are required to use at least a 505.01 certified oil. 506.01 and 507.00 are also authorized.

 

[UG_Passat]

Originally Posted By: Fuzz1
Can anyone highlight the difference in formulation and specs.

How do these specs compare to eg. API specs , especially CI4+ as well as ACEA spec such as B4-04 or B4-07.

I read that they are mutually exclusive and are not intercangeable.

I read on many forum that the 505.01 is far superior to the API CI4 spec and cant be used in high revving small capicity high output diesel engines.


505.01 is designed to with greater anti-wear & shear additives because the Pumpe-Duse injectors are timed using a camshaft-- minimizing the wear on the camshaft is critical to the operation of the engine.

It has a unique property though, it initially shears down to a thinner oil, then as soot builds up it returns to its original thickness.

Trying to compare to API is a little tricky though.

At least with 505.00, it is easy-- oils that meet 505.00 also met API CF.

505.01 is a difficult though, since the majority of the oils weren't tested with API in mind. According to Amsoil, looking at the "AFL", Euro formula specs, it happens to perform similar API CF oil, ACEA A3/B4/B3-04.

 

[Tornado Red]

Originally Posted By: Fuzz1
Can anyone highlight the difference in formulation and specs.

How do these specs compare to eg. API specs , especially CI4+ as well as ACEA spec such as B4-04 or B4-07.

I read that they are mutually exclusive and are not intercangeable.

I read on many forum that the 505.01 is far superior to the API CI4 spec and cant be used in high revving small capicity high output diesel engines.

There are NO engine oils that meet both an API CI-4/CJ-4 rating AND any VW specification. In that respect they are mutually exclusive.

However, some older VW diesel engines are happy with either one.

If your owner's manual says to use VW505.01 only, then use it or the new VW507.00 which supercedes 505.01.

If your owner's manual says to use VW505.00, then a synthetic API-rated 5w40 should work just fine. And a newly-reformulated API oil might even work better than an older, weaker 505.00. For instance, in the US the Mobil 1 5w40 is generally better than an older Castrol 5w40 product.

 

[TeeDub]

VW 505.01 is a very weak additive spec...you'd be better off running a CJ-4 rated, 5w-40 in any automotive diesel that does not have a particle trap filter. This specifically includes the PD-TDI's once they're through the warranty phase.

TD

 

[Tornado Red]

Originally Posted By: TeeDub
VW 505.01 is a very weak additive spec...you'd be better off running a CJ-4 rated, 5w-40 in any automotive diesel that does not have a particle trap filter. This specifically includes the PD-TDI's once they're through the warranty phase.

TD

I generally agree with this... except I don't own a PD. What a TDI PD owner pours in his crankcase after the warranty runs out is up to him. He should be aware of the possible risks -- but I can't tell him how serious those risks are, because I don't know.

 

[wjdell]

I firmly believe that 505.01 is emissions driven - mainly. Less ash is the call for all oil makers NA or Europe. This would tend to better for the rings also, but so is the CJ4 spec. I know of no special additives in 505.01 nor has anyone else shown any real proof that there is any special additives in 505.01 oils. If there is a difference in 505.00 to 505.01 as related to the cam then it would probably be the oils TRACTION. To much traction or to little traction is the main cause of cam galling. In reality hydrodynamics is most important when it comes to forming a barrier between cam and lifter. 505.00 is actually better when it comes to this quality.

 

[Izb]

Originally Posted By: UG_Passat

505.01 is designed to with greater anti-wear & shear additives because the Pumpe-Duse injectors are timed using a camshaft-- minimizing the wear on the camshaft is critical to the operation of the engine.

It has a unique property though, it initially shears down to a thinner oil, then as soot builds up it returns to its original thickness.

Trying to compare to API is a little tricky though.

At least with 505.00, it is easy-- oils that meet 505.00 also met API CF.

505.01 is a difficult though, since the majority of the oils weren't tested with API in mind. According to Amsoil, looking at the "AFL", Euro formula specs, it happens to perform similar API CF oil, ACEA A3/B4/B3-04.




If I like "greater anti-wear & shear additives" of 505.01, can I use such great oils on gasoline engine (for less wear)?

 

[synormin]

Originally Posted By: TeeDub
VW 505.01 is a very weak additive spec...you'd be better off running a CJ-4 rated, 5w-40 in any automotive diesel that does not have a particle trap filter. This specifically includes the PD-TDI's once they're through the warranty phase.

TD

When I bought my '96 Passat TDI the previous owner had been using CI-4+ Rotella 5W40. First oil change I used CJ-4 RTS....next oil change LubroMoly Diesel High Tech and the engine was noticeably smoother. I use CJ-4 RTS in my 87 Vanagon but for the Passat the LM Diesel oil seems better. Is this perceived smoothness spec related...or in my head?

 

[Tornado Red]

Originally Posted By: synormin
When I bought my '96 Passat TDI the previous owner had been using CI-4+ Rotella 5W40. First oil change I used CJ-4 RTS....next oil change LubroMoly Diesel High Tech and the engine was noticeably smoother. I use CJ-4 RTS in my 87 Vanagon but for the Passat the LM Diesel oil seems better. Is this perceived smoothness spec related...or in my head?


Your TDI engine may have been running more smoothly for a completely different reason, unrelated to the oil. I bought a 5-liter jug of LM 5w40 a couple years ago and never got around to using it, so I can't tell you whether it makes a noticeable difference. But I have added LM MoS2 oil additive to get a little extra moly and a little extra anti-wear, over and above what I get with M1 TDT.

 

[synormin]

Quote:
Your TDI engine may have been running more smoothly for a completely different reason, unrelated to the oil. I bought a 5-liter jug of LM 5w40 a couple years ago and never got around to using it, so I can't tell you whether it makes a noticeable difference. But I have added LM MoS2 oil additive to get a little extra moly and a little extra anti-wear, over and above what I get with M1 TDT.


Forgot to mention that I started using RL 85+ diesel additive at the time of the LM oil change too...so that may have been my difference right there.