PAO vs Polyolester Basestocks

G-MAN · Jan 14, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by MolaKule:
Anything is possible, but I took the reading to mean a blend of synthetic oils,
which jives with the paper which lists three esters, MPE/TME/DPE.

Let me take a closer look at the German .pdf file.

The telling phrase in the German tech sheet is "Mobil syst S 5W-40 ist eine attraktive Alternative zu vollsynthetischen Motorenölen." Translated: "Mobil syst s 5w40 is an attractive alternative to full synthetic motor oils."

BTW, which "paper" are you referring to?

MolaKule · Jan 14, 2003

Thanks,

I too, got that much out of it.

Paper is:
"High Stability Esters for Synthetic Lubricant Applications."

[ January 15, 2003, 01:11 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

MolaKule · Jan 15, 2003

Referring to the Mobil System-S 5W40 German .pdf file:

In the first paragraph, right under the description (Beschreibung), the first sentence does read, "Mobil system S 5W40 is an attractive alternative to synthetic motor oils."

However, the last paragraph seems to say,

"Mobil system S 5W40 performs so well as a racing motor oil because it contains expansive (many types of) synthetic components."

My German is rusty, but that's what it seems to say, so the last sentence in the description appears to contradict the first sentence.

Anyone else on the board read German?

[ January 15, 2003, 10:28 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

satterfi · Jan 15, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by MolaKule:
Referring to the Mobil System-S 5W40 German .pdf file:

Anyone else on the board read German?

Babel Fish does.

Babel Fish

Here's the translation of the meaningful part.

Description Mobilely S 5W-40 syst is an attractive alternative to full-synthetic engine oils. Mobilely S 5W-40 syst lubricates the engine reliably and fast with the cold weather starting and forms a load-carrying oil film with high engine temperatures and loads. It protects so the engine under all operating conditions reliably against wear. Mobilely S 5W-40 syst makes a contribution for fuel saving and exceeds the quality criteria of conventional mineral engine oils by its synthetic components by far.

Characteristic/advantages · oil composition and flow behavior at low temperatures (SAE 5W) reduce the engine friction. That means: More easily cold weather starting and fuel economy · outstanding engine cleanliness · optimal protection of the engine from wear, also under strongly changing temperatures and load conditions · outstanding suitably in the stop & Go-enterprise · reduced oil consumption due to its low evaporation inclination · catalyst-suitably and.

Application Mobilely S 5W-40 syst is suitable for petrol and diesel engines of all manufacturers in passenger vehicles, delivery vans and minibuses with and without superchargers. It is particularly co-ordinated with the climatic conditions dominant in Europe.

Pops · Jan 15, 2003

Terry Dyson thinks it is some super duper racing oil here

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=11;t=000034

What is it? just a group III with a new ester?

jason07-1zzfe · Jan 15, 2003

Wow, and for the price he said it cost!? Or is just that all oil is expensive in Europe?

MolaKule · Jan 15, 2003

I don't think this oil (the Mobil sys S 5W40) is the full synthetic oil their paper(s) were alluding to.

They have tested a number of 5W40 formulations, but have never mentioned
a "blended" oil in all of their public forrays.

TooSlick · Jan 16, 2003

If you look at the physical properties specs for this stuff - a VI of 166 and a pour point of -38F, it looks like a Group III basestock. Since ExxonMobil only considers PAO/Ester based oils to be "true" synthetics, they aren't calling it one ....

MolaKule · Jan 16, 2003

It now appears to be a majority Group III base oil with PAO and ester components.

[ January 16, 2003, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]

Alex D · Apr 20, 2003

......read here that German language knowledge is sometimes needed on the fourm......well, I am German. Was born and raised in Hamburg, Germany. Went to school there and moved to the US in 1990..became US citizen in 1998...so if you need a translation from German let me know.......German is my mother language.........

buster · Apr 20, 2003

Cool, thats great. I'm sure the translation need will arise again at some point. Now, whats with chancellor schroeder not supporting the US in the war?

Just joking.

Flimflam · Apr 21, 2003

quote:

Originally posted by Bror Jace:
Thanks, 'Kule for setting the record straight. Do you know for sure if the ester in Mobil 1 is a polyol ... or a dibasic ester? I always thought the latter ...

Anyway, it seems Mobil wants to have it both ways ... and I'm not sure they can even be honest with themselves. They want to say that their Mobil 1 is the best high-performance oils available anywhere on the planet ... period. And this is just silly.

They would rather come out with one compromise (if generally competent) formula and make up the difference with a lot of slick hype. Even with the latest modern synthesizing technology, bull$#i+ is cheaper than polyol. And, when someone comes along and knows enough to as an intelligent question on the issue, they change the subject.

--- Bror Jace

Well said, Bror Jace. My thoughts exactly. M*1 is positively, absolutely, undoubtedly the slickest, greasiest b*llsh*t and hype campaign since the Keating Savings & Loans scandals. The sad part of it is, they have built up a corps of "the sorry @ssed brainwashed" who are ready to jump up and flame anybody who tells the truth about M*1.

Keep up the good work, Jace. Show the slick b*stards we know all about their scam.

electrolover · Mar 9, 2011

wow i guess he doesn't like M1 very much

BobFout · Mar 9, 2011

Necroposting!

M1 is still the 'standard' for oil.

tig1 · Mar 9, 2011

Notice his name is Flimflam. Means a deceiver. Here is a link.

http://www.audioenglish.net/dictionary/flim-flam.htm

shpankey · Mar 10, 2011

Wow, talk about rising from the dead. Awesome thread though, wish more old timers with knowledge like these guys had still posted like this.

addyguy · Mar 10, 2011

Wow, what an old post!

But yeah, great info in it!

electrolover · Mar 10, 2011

kinda why i brought it back. those old threads were awesome! they had alot of chemists and stuff. i read alot of them and understand a little bit

but im learning, i just wish we had some great info on todays oil too. those "old timers" really had the SL of the day figured out

old farmer · Mar 14, 2011

Maybe Mobil means that for most people esters are just way over the top and too expensive, for a total ester product.
PAOs can shrink seals and esters swell them too much. Regular oils swell them a little bit and this is expected.
So to keep the seal swell in the normal range, M1 adds some ester to the PAO oil. So your already getting some.

LoneRanger · May 7, 2013

Except that Mobil might no longer use ester, they seem to have replaced it with Alkylated Naphthalene in majority of their OTC oils.

PAO vs Polyolester Basestocks

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