Sams Club Incident

[Axe Man]

Vehicle: 2007 Suzuki Grand Vitara.

The OEM tires for this SUV are 225/70R16 Yokohama Geolandar H/T G92C. Speed rating H and a UTQG of 280 BA. I had read in Suzuki forums that these tires from an overall wear perspective are pretty dismal. Sure enough, just turned 30K miles and needed new rubber.

Started searching around for tires with better wear numbers and reasonably priced. Found Goodyear Integrity in the proper size at Sam's Club for $87/ea. Specs on these tires were speed rating S and UTQG of 480 AB. Lower speed rating but much better wear numbers. So off to Sam's I go.

Get there, order up the tires, start the checkout process. Tech is putting in all the info and then the computer spits out something about these are the incorrect tires for that vehicle. Tech states that OEM tires had an H speed rating and these tires are S speed rated and you can't go down two speed ratings. In his words it would cause "adverse handling" and vehicle will "squirm" and "wander" on the road. My "baloney detector" immediately went into the red zone and I smelled "upsale". My words to him was this was an SUV that never sees more than 80 MPH. Why would a speed rating of 112 MPH vs 130 MPH make any difference? If it was a Porsche or Corvette, sure, that speed rating is important. We went back and forth for a few minutes and then the tech checked the tire label on the SUV itself. All it said was "225/70R16" with no speed rating. At that point the tech agreed to put the tires on and I was on my merry way.

So BITOG's...was I wrong? Is the lower speed rating going to cause problems? I haven't noticed any difference in the vehicle handling other than it no longer has a tendency to hydroplane in the wet because the old tries were worn out. And that's on the good side. I suspect that the reason H rated tires are OEM on the Grand Vitara is because it's also sold in Europe where average speeds are higher.

 

[Drew99GT]

You're not wrong at all.

Good luck with the Integrities though. The ones on our Impala were bald before 30,000 miles.

 

[ThirdeYe]

Should be no problem. My car has lower speed rating economy tires and it's gone 100+ with no problems. Handles perfectly fine.

 

[MI_Roger]

MY car came equipped with V-rated summer/all-season tires and I ran Q-rated snow tires for a couple winters. The car was definitely squirmy at expressway speeds with the lower rated tires. I have since used H-rated winter tires with much better road manners.

The store is only trying to protect their butt against drivers making poor decisions. The real question is why did a small SUV have H-rated tires originally? Not exactly a performance vehicle.

 

[Axe Man]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
You're not wrong at all.

Good luck with the Integrities though. The ones on our Impala were bald before 30,000 miles.


Well, these Integrities have a 50K mile tread wear warranty. I'll keep'em rotated and if they wear out sooner I'll be yelling.

 

[Axe Man]

Originally Posted By: MI_Roger
The store is only trying to protect their butt against drivers making poor decisions.


Agreed.

Quote:
The real question is why did a small SUV have H-rated tires originally? Not exactly a performance vehicle.


The GV is also sold in Europe. The factory probably stuck with a H rated tires to cover all the bases (and probably got a good deal on price from Yokohama).

 

[bepperb]

The Sams Club guy was right to warn you about the lower speed rating. Would you rather buy from a place that wouldn't even know or check? Most large tire stores won't even put the lower speed tires on, and some Sams locations won't either. Just a liability thing. I agree with you, that it won't matter. But some uneducated person goes out and hurts themselves and plays the blame game and then these policies come as a result of that.

The Integrities probably won't get you much better than 30-40,000 either, sorry to say they're the whipping boy of my Highlander forum. But, the Dueller 687's that Sams also stocks in that size aren't much better and cost another 20 bucks, and then the Michelins are 150 bucks, so I see how you made your choice, assuming you have the same options I do.

 

[chevrofreak]

When I had new tires installed on my moms car at Costco a couple years ago they would only go down 1 speed rating in the tires they installed.

 

[stockrex]

both sams and costco have a policy not to put anylower
than manufacturer spec.
if u have issues blame the manufacturer.
2nd option: buy tire at sams but mount somewhere else like a tirerack suggested installer

 

[OrdnanceMarine]

Speed rating and tire ride/handling characteristics are not necessarily tied together. Speed rating is just the ability to take certain forces and temperatures. You *could* make a tire with no/low speed rating that handled quite well. I can also vouch for the fact that there are some sloppy tires out there that have high speed ratings.

 

[daves87rs]

I guess better to be safe than sorry...

Hopefully those Goodyears will last...

 

[Mr Nice]

No problems at all, but the guy wants to sell you the more expensive H rated tires.

 

[bdcardinal]

they are trying to CYA, if anything happened because of having the lower speed rated tires on there you could sue them.

 

[Ibrahim]

you should have also looked for these tires

Kumho Solus KR21

very cheap and lasts very long!

 

[stockrex]

my experience:
dunlop- worst I used
goodyear - suck in winter, had belt fail in new tire
michelins - very best, soft as whipped cream in winter, noisy when down to half thread
bfgoodriches- same rubber as michelins, soft, best value

 

[Axe Man]

Guys, I accept the liability factor. Plus I accept that the tech had an obligation to tell me about the difference in speed ratings. But let's apply some good ole common sense. Who's gonna drive a Grand Vitara at 130 MPH on U.S. roads? Or even 112 MPH? I really doubt it could attain those speeds anyway.

Plus, here's a kicker. I searched the Sam's site for tires by vehicle type, not tire size. Their site came back with the Goodyears. If they were unsuitable don't you think their site should have filtered out lower speed ratings? It didn't.

 

[Mr Nice]

This reminds me of the post about a Scion and ZR rated tires.

 

[peterdaniel]

Why you would wish to compromise in one of the most important safety devices on a vehicle is beyond me. S speed rating is about as low as you get besides T and Im not sure they even make that anymore. Its bargain basement and the fact that the intergritys are rated that ( S rating) doesn't surprise me.

But understand, thats not where it stops, yes they have to meet a certain gov't standard otherwise they couldn't be sold legally. Most likely thats not all where they cheaped out. Goodyear did their research and the the Integrity was an OEM tire IIRC and as such, it is made for the lowest common denominator.

H speed rating these days is the minimum I would put on anything I own. It says to me that the tire can handle just about anything I can throw at it including hot long running, lower tire pressure, hard handling because the sidewall flex would be much much stiffer.

Most likely your vehicle is classified as a truck and therefore needs the stiffer side wall because it can carry more weight ) passengers,. gear etc..)

In your case the H speed rating most likely had nothing to do with speed at all but rather all the other factors that come with the H rating.

Sam's club was wrong to allow you to push them around. The world especially today is just looking like a hawk for lawsuits and they provided you the perfect opportunity.

 

[bepperb]

My theorem:

Compact SUV's = Families
Families = Teenagers
1/2 of Teenagers = Male
Male Teenagers + anything wheel-ed = 112+ mph speeds
112+ mph speeds + not 112mph tires = Sams Club Lawsuit
Sams Club Lawsuit = You getting grief from the tire guy.

 

[oldmaninsc]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
You're not wrong at all.

Good luck with the Integrities though. The ones on our Impala were bald before 30,000 miles.

I agree. I used to be a big fan of Goodyear tires, but over the last few years their quality seems to have declined.
My wife's Camry came from the factory with Integrity tires. After about 20K I replaced them. There was still some tread left, but the sidewalls were starting to crack.

I've had Goodyear tires on my other two vehicles (SUV and van)
The van had Integrity tires and they lasted about 25K miles.
The SUV has Goodyear Forterra and I'd be surprised if they make 35K miles. They are at about 15K miles now and I'd say they are about 1/2 wore out.

I've been hearing people call them "Good for a year" lately!

I personally think it's a case of you get what you pay for.