More bailouts...

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL

Using Quebec as an example of how things are in Canada is like using Mexico as an example of how things are in the US.

I'll take your word for it.

It's still state run medical is it not?


But each province is different. Ontario coverage is different from Alberta coverage for example. And while you can use an Ontario card anywhere in Canada, there is a procedure for doing so, as each province has their own policies.

Quebec is the odd duck. Many things that fly in the rest of Canada are the opposite in Quebec. If you look up the Bloc Quebecois you'll begin to understand a bit

 

[StevieC]

Quebec is not just the odd duck on Health Care, they are the "Arse-Backwards-ness" of all Canadian Policy. What I don't understand is that most of the country works on the same policies give/take a few here/there but in Quebec it's like they are trying to be different "Just because". IMO

It's a fun place to visit though... and I always get drunk and have a good time in Quebec, but I wouldn't want to live there.

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
It's a fun place to visit though... and I always get drunk and have a good time in Quebec, but I wouldn't want to live there.


ThAY prroov-Ide-i le bourgeoisie meedeel c'lass with entear-tainment, no? Spend ryour monEE ...and geet the (blank) owit.

 

[kelpie]

I'll have to add that I drive a truck and go into Southern Ontario regularly. Out of curiosity, I asked a couple guys at the shipping office how they liked their health care service in CA. They replied that it isn't even an issue there like it is in the USA. They don't even think about it. No worries about paying, going broke over medical bills, etc. I asked one of them if they would trade theirs for ours, and you could guess the answer.

 

[StevieC]

That's true... I had to have open heart surgery to correct a leaking valve when I was younger and not only am I still here today but the Government covered the bill. My parents didn't even have to sell the house. Cost us no more than the taxes they take off our cheques. We pay more taxes than the US but I feel we get it back in return for health care being covered. There are rumors about people waiting months for surgeries etc. but in truth it's not such a bad system, everyone in my opinion, gets treated fairly and in a timely fashion depending on their needs.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: StevieC
Everywhere in Canada, health care is run by the Government and it's a good system. Not the as good as private care, but it works and I wouldn't trade it at all. The horror stories I hear going on in the US makes me glad I'm Canadian.

Again, like I posted in another thread about the same subject about a fellow Canadian and how he got his FREE excellent Canadian Health care;

Quote:
Or fly to another country like my Best Friend's Dad who needed Eye surgery. He was on the waiting list for 9 months, got to that time and since he was not blind yet (cataract, can not see straight forward only about 25% around it.) and is older (71) they put him back on the bottom of the list.

He is staying with us recovering nicely. (had the operation at my wife's Hospital) Ask him what he thinks about his health "care". (and the $12-15k check he will be writing soon. On top of a $400 air fare from Toronto to here)

I'll stick with what we have thank you. (as someone who had a Operation last year with no waiting, no hassles and covered by insurance minus deductibles)

Take care, bill

 

[StevieC]

Bill I wasn't going against what you said, just trying to clear up Myths... I understand that you know what it is like up here.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: kelpie
I'll have to add that I drive a truck and go into Southern Ontario regularly. Out of curiosity, I asked a couple guys at the shipping office how they liked their health care service in CA. They replied that it isn't even an issue there like it is in the USA. They don't even think about it. No worries about paying, going broke over medical bills, etc. I asked one of them if they would trade theirs for ours, and you could guess the answer.
Most Sheeple don't have to worry about much...

Why think? Why take care of your own matters?

They are there to "help" you....

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: StevieC
Bill I wasn't going against what you said, just trying to clear up Myths... I understand that you know what it is like up here.

Just letting you know that one of your Citizens is here paying for what your "free" super duper health care does.

Its NOT a rumor about people waiting months for surgeries etc.

IT IS A FACT!

I think it is a crime that a senior has to wait 9 months to get a pre operation appt then be told to wait another who knows how long to get CARE.

Then pay out of your own pocket for the care in another country.

Lucky for him, he has quite a bit of money from the dealerships he sold a few years ago.

What would happen for the person who did not have the funds?

I guess wait for the excellent health care system to give them free care.... Hopefully before they die.

Sorry. I'm ticked at what this good friend has gone through. Thankfully the operation went well and he will be back home in a few weeks.

Bill

 

[StevieC]

Yeah but I would rather have to put up with some inconvenience than loose my house because I have to have heart surgery and my health care provider decides to deny my claim. What the heck is up with that? You pay into a plan and then they deny you or pay out then cancel your insurance and then no other insurance will cover you? Sounds like you have a much better system than us. At least mine can't be cancelled!

Second of all all critical patients get first priority so its not like you are going to wait for a life saving surgery.

I'm here with no debt and have had open heart surgery as a kid. If I was in your country I probably would not be insurable and my parents might have lost their house.

It's pretty bad when an American has to make a movie about how bad your system is to get some sort of response from insurance companies and your government.

Not that that's the only thing I have drawn my conclusions from, as I do have friends all over the states that have horror stories to tell.

 

[Bill in Utah]

We will see when you are 71 and need to see how you think waiting 9 months with the condition and then being told sorry, wait some more.

If you think Moore is a American (I'll be quiet now... I'd be banned for what I was ready to type)

Amazing..

 

[StevieC]

How about when you get older and need some life saving surgery that causes your insurance to be canceled and/or denied payment. Then are you going to immigrate to Canada?

Good luck with your system. Mine might be slow, but it's not deniable unlike you poor people who work so hard only to have "Corporate America" deny you the liberty of prosperity and life itself because you will bankrupt over a "For Profit but Fast" system!

FYI I waited 2 weeks to have my surgery when I was a kid, and my dad just had a knee replaced and only waited 2 months. BIG DEAL!

And I'm currently on a waiting list of 3 weeks to have an MRI for re-occurring migraines (monthly). They aren't life threatening, just annoying and they want to see if there is some other cause.

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
I had to have open heart surgery to correct a leaking valve when I was younger and not only am I still here today but the Government covered the bill.

No, your fellow Canadians were forced to pay your medical expenses for you, and you seem quite happy with that.

Should it be legal to mug people on the street for your medical care?

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
What would happen for the person who did not have the funds?


What will happen if you have your way here?


All costs are paid by producers. It's that simple.

 

[Tempest]

Costs are paid by end users, which would put competition into the system.

US vs. Canada = Socialized vs. private is a myth.

Canada is 70% and the US is about %44 socialized. That makes the US government the primary care payer and all other people have to compete with it for services and resources. This significantly skews the market and removes much of the competition.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
I had to have open heart surgery to correct a leaking valve when I was younger and not only am I still here today but the Government covered the bill.

No, your fellow Canadians were forced to pay your medical expenses for you, and you seem quite happy with that.

Should it be legal to mug people on the street for your medical care?


You say the exact same thing about our system, Tempest.


Just let them die in the alleged greatest nation on earth ... the finest example of Capitalism at its best.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
I had to have open heart surgery to correct a leaking valve when I was younger and not only am I still here today but the Government covered the bill.

No, your fellow Canadians were forced to pay your medical expenses for you, and you seem quite happy with that.

Should it be legal to mug people on the street for your medical care?


If somebody doesn't want to pay into the Canadian tax system, they don't need to live here. There is not "forced". People are not FORCED to live in this country. When you live in Canada, it is well known that part of your tax dollars go to the health care system.

What is it with you? Why so "anti Canadian Health Care"? You are like Negative Nancy on a subject you really have no experience with.

News Flash: You don't live here. WE DO.

So until you move to Canada and have information other than [censored] pulled from the Internet in an attempt to bolster your "case" you are doing nothing more than blowing hot air.

I have more experience with the Canadian Health Care system than like ANY of the Americans who have contributed to this thread.

My Cousin: Leukemia

My Grandfather: Lung Cancer

My Grandmother: Colon Cancer

My Grandfather: Heart Attack, broken ribs, stroke, took his fingers off with a snow blower....etc.

My Grandmother: Multiple strokes and heart attacks.

My mother: Mild traumatic head injury due to a car accident.

My wife: Colon surgery, our three children

Myself: Pneumonia, sinus problems

Not to mention the countless trips to the ER for sick children and the like.

My grandfather was in there for MONTHS in the ICU, and his care was fantastic.

When my cousin had Leukemia, he got the best care they could give him at Sick Kids hospital. There was no waiting.


And plenty more. I have a very big family.




There are SOME cases where the system has failed.

There are SOME cases of extended wait times that are beyond reasonable.


But for the most part the system WORKS. If it didn't, I'd be [censored] about it too, as would other Canadians who have contributed to this thread.

Perhaps the fact that we are NOT complaining should be a clue to the fact that the picture painted by the press is not necessarily an accurate representation of what it's like in most places in Canada.

 

[Gary Allan]

Canada has a health care system they can be proud of. Any system will have its fringe liabilities and shortcomings, but there is no inherent flaw with how Canada handles the health of their population. Health care on demand is very expensive. In our country it's managed by putting those who can't afford it on the slow track waiting line ..at much higher costs.

As OVERKILL states, if it was all so pathetic and miserable... they would be screaming and whining about it. They're not. They acknowledge the benefits with the liabilities and the balance sheet looks favorable ..to a decent margin.

There you have it Tempest. Canada is filled with demotivated losers and slackers that want to suck the teet of the public dole ..snort drugs ..screw off ..smoke ..engage in unhealthy lifestyles..just to get the free lunch at the hospitals and clinics.

 

[javacontour]

But can't the same be said here in the US, for most it works.

If that's the criteria for figuring out if we need to change it or not, then as long as it works for most or the most part as you say, then we shouldn't be looking at any other solutions.

Looking around I find status such as this:

Quote:

In the United States, around 84.7% of citizens have some form of health insurance; either through their employer (59.3%), purchased individually (8.9%), or provided by government programs (27.8%; there is some overlap in these figures).[28] Certain publicly-funded health care programs help to provide for the elderly, disabled, children, veterans, and some of the poor, and federal law mandates public access to emergency services regardless of ability to pay. U.S. government programs accounted for over 45% of health care expenditures, making the U.S. government the largest insurer in the nation. Per capita spending on health care by the U.S. government placed it among the top ten highest spenders among United Nations member countries in 2004.[29]


Other places give similar numbers. Which means the majority of Americans ARE insured. That would be about 6 out of 7 are insured.

So if it works for the most part, and 6 out of 7 is the most part, then why mess with it?

Because we spend the 2nd most as a percentage of GNP (only the Marshall Islands spends more as a percentage of GNP on healthcare) on the planet.

So getting this into one program is nothing more than a money grab. Folks want control over that 15%+ of our GNP.

 

[StevieC]

Because in our system 7 out of 7 get treated. Why should any Citizen of your country not be given the right to live in some cases because they can't get the required medical treatment they require?