Hunter Hawkeye alignment system-Good?

[Russell]

Is the Hunter Hawkeye high-definition wheel alignment system worth the extra trouble and cost?

My local tire dealer has recently installled this system and they are the first alignment place that will properly weight my BMW for an alignment. You are supposed to have a full tank of fuel and them place weights in the car to simulate a driver and passenger. They charge $99 for a BMW.

They also do a centerline steering adjustment as well as front toe in. In addition they reference the front wheel alignment to the rear wheel thrust line as my rear suspension is not adjustable. Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

Just looking for the opinion of those knowledgable of alignment systems. TIA

 

[Dominic]

If they can only adjust toe on that car, it's not really worth it.

What are you trying to achieve with the alignment? If you're looking for more performance typically you want to dial in more camber and caster and make sure the toe is absolutely 0 for street use. That said, $99 isn't really expensive either.

 

[Russell]

Originally Posted By: Dominic
If they can only adjust toe on that car, it's not really worth it.

What are you trying to achieve with the alignment? If you're looking for more performance typically you want to dial in more camber and caster and make sure the toe is absolutely 0 for street use. That said, $99 isn't really expensive either.


I have a wandering issue. Tires seems to wear fairly evenly. I rotate about every 7,000 miles. It may be the rear end sub frame bushings worn enough to cause some rear steering. I am also hoping their detailed printouts will show where I may have worn suspension components.

 

[alreadygone]

Obviously, setting the toe isn't gonna correct wander issue. I do alignments. The BEST alignment shop is 35 miles north, where they have no "machine" at all! Everything is done with turntables and guages. What you need is an experienced (preferably with BMW) alignment technician to give your car a good inspection, find/replace bad/worn parts, THEN do an alignment.

Kinda like welding, the MAN does the work. Better equipment just makes him faster.

Bob

 

[Russell]

Originally Posted By: alreadygone
Obviously, setting the toe isn't gonna correct wander issue. I do alignments. The BEST alignment shop is 35 miles north, where they have no "machine" at all! Everything is done with turntables and guages. What you need is an experienced (preferably with BMW) alignment technician to give your car a good inspection, find/replace bad/worn parts, THEN do an alignment.

Kinda like welding, the MAN does the work. Better equipment just makes him faster.

Bob


Had the alignment done today. Ending up costing only $59.00. It turned out they did not have the weights after all. I sat in the car during part of the alignment with a full tank of gas. Also. tech is experienced on this machine and performance handling. First thing he did was take a test drive and noticed the wander issue.

Bottom line is the front toe was way off specs; plus 0.58 on driver's side and negative -0.31 on passenger side. When they were done the steering wheel was centered for the first time! Have not driven my normal commute route so I am not sure how well it will do regarding wandering. However on other driving it just seems much more precise.

The print-out (before and after) also indicated I have too much rear camber. As I have original rear struts and springs, they may just be tired. Also right front caster is slightly out of spec. Not sure why. It may be the result of a fender bender last year.

My next suspension work will be to verify proper ride height. I also need new rear struts and possibly springs.

This seems to be the best alignment I have ever received. Time will tell.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Russell
You are supposed to have a full tank of fuel and them place weights in the car to simulate a driver and passenger. They charge $99 for a BMW

The rule I know is a 1/2 full tank and the weight of the driver in the driver's seat.


Quote:
They also do a centerline steering adjustment as well as front toe in.

Why wouldn't they? It's part of the proper alignment.

Quote:
Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

I don't buy that claim.



Proper alignment for a Euro car with a relatively complex setup starts locally at around $130 and takes about 30 to 45 minutes on an optical Hunter machine. Be advised that some of the bolts that are loosened and tightened may be one-time-use torque-to-yield bolts.

 

[Russell]

Originally Posted By: moribundman
Originally Posted By: Russell
You are supposed to have a full tank of fuel and them place weights in the car to simulate a driver and passenger. They charge $99 for a BMW

The rule I know is a 1/2 full tank and the weight of the driver in the driver's seat.


Quote:
They also do a centerline steering adjustment as well as front toe in.

Why wouldn't they? It's part of the proper alignment.

Apparently this was not done by my previous two alignments

Quote:
Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

I don't buy that claim.
Please tell me how on a 95 BMW, I see no adjustments



Proper alignment for a Euro car with a relatively complex setup starts locally at around $130 and takes about 30 to 45 minutes on an optical Hunter machine.

 

[Steve S]

Depends on the guy doing the work and the ultimate is whether the alignment is done to within specs or the exact numbers . My wife has a 2002 superduty Ford p/u which wore the outside edges of the front tires. I brought it in to ger it aligned and the guy came to me scratching his head saying ,it is within specs. I had to explain to him I wanted it set to exact specs. I went into the shop and showed him what to do and now there is no more uneven wear. It is terrible when I have to agree with Mori!!!

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Russell
Quote:
Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

I don't buy that claim.
Please tell me how on a 95 BMW, I see no adjustments


That's a shame. You can get adjustable caster/camber plates that allow adjustment.

 

[Steve S]

Originally Posted By: moribundman
Originally Posted By: Russell
Quote:
Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

I don't buy that claim.
Please tell me how on a 95 BMW, I see no adjustments


That's a shame. You can get adjustable caster/camber plates that allow adjustment.
Mori read my post you are ignoring me again!!!

 

[moribundman]

On my car I had to got to the extreme limits of the factory specs (0 toe) to achieve the best possible wear on the front tires. The outer edges still wear proportionally more compared to the rest of the treads, but it's due to my driving style.

The rear tires are set dead-nuts to spec with essentially +/- 0 tolerance for perfect wear across.

Thrust angle is 0.

 

[moribundman]

Originally Posted By: Steve S
Mori read my post you are ignoring me again!!!
Mori, read my post. You are ignoring me again!


There, happy now?

 

[Russell]

Originally Posted By: moribundman
Originally Posted By: Russell
Quote:
Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

I don't buy that claim.
Please tell me how on a 95 BMW, I see no adjustments


That's a shame. You can get adjustable caster/camber plates that allow adjustment.


Sure. Rather expensive. About $300 plus per axle not including installation. Not going to happen for a commuter car.

BTW, my thurst angle is now .02 degress. It was 0 before adjustment

 

[moribundman]

How do the rear tires wear? Are there any tracking issues?

 

[Russell]

Originally Posted By: moribundman
How do the rear tires wear? Are there any tracking issues?


I rotate every 7,000 or so, rear wear appears fairly even with tendency for rear outer edge wear. Before alignment, yet I had wandering issues, following the road imperfections (tracking?) and a crooked steering wheel. Seems much better now. Will know more on monday after my commute.

 

[moribundman]

Tracking, or rather tramlining, which you describe, is in my experience often caused by directional, assymmetrical tire tread designs. That's why I prefer symmetrical, unidirectional tires.

After putting new tires on, I drive them until the front tires show some wear at the outer edge. I then rotate the front to the rear and the rear to the front. I usually do not change the direction of rotation to avoid temporarily increased wear.

 

[Russell]

In my case I am using directional tires and they are rotated front to rear only.

I recently removed my Michelin Exalto A/S 225x60x15 All Season tires and installed 205x65x15 Firestone Winterforce non-studded winter tires. I then had the alignemnt done about 300 miles later.

 

[rg200amp]

Originally Posted By: Russell
Is the Hunter Hawkeye high-definition wheel alignment system worth the extra trouble and cost?

My local tire dealer has recently installled this system and they are the first alignment place that will properly weight my BMW for an alignment. You are supposed to have a full tank of fuel and them place weights in the car to simulate a driver and passenger. They charge $99 for a BMW.

They also do a centerline steering adjustment as well as front toe in. In addition they reference the front wheel alignment to the rear wheel thrust line as my rear suspension is not adjustable. Caster and camber front/rear is not adjustable.

Just looking for the opinion of those knowledgable of alignment systems. TIA


I do not know much, but I do know this:
My buddy has a car customs shop in Philadelphia and he had a Hunter Roadforce balancer. He was the only one for a while to have this thing. Bmw and Mercedes dealers would send there hige end cars to him for a bit just because of his equipment. The Hunter system your talking about sounds even more involved than his Roadforce system.

That just what I know. Is it worth it? I have no idea!