Antifreeze Confusion!

[Propflux01]

Need to replace the coolant in 2 Hyundai's. Figure I might as well do those, since for the last 2 weeks I have been dealing with my daughters 3.1L GM LIM nightmare, and now consider myself an expert at getting antifreeze on my hands. Both Hyundai's call for "A good quality Ethylene Glycol Coolant". Now after the disgust with the 3.1LIM, I used prestone 'mixes with anything' in the 3.1L. I figure that car so falling apart now and wont last a couple more years anyhow, so I could just put anything in. The Hyundai's, however, get special lovin'. After reading the last 7 pages here about OATS and HOATS and greens and pinks and dexcools and G-05's, 2-EH's phosphates and silicones and free-of's and sludges and whatnot, I have came to the conclusion that I am now more confused then ever on what to put back in these vehicles. I am a firm believer that OEM stuff is usually the weakest most overpriced shiite on the market anyhow, hence the reason we have some many aftermarket items to choose from. That being said, what can I SAFELY use in these cars without killing radiators, gaskets, etc? and the second question is what brands and where can I get them?

 

[jldcol]

If you do not want to use oem fluids you should at least find out it's chemistry and pick from aftermarket ones with the same.

 

[Propflux01]

Best I can figure, the OEM is the old 'green stuff'.

 

[nutdriver]

Assuming you have the generic "green" antifreeze, I would consider a quick flush with distilled water and drain. Repeat quick flush with distilled water. Drain again. Also drain completely the coolant overflow container and clean out with fresh water. Fill system to 1/2 the cooling system capacity with concentrated Toyota Red. Fill to the top with distilled water. Fill to the min line the overflow container with Toyota red diluted with equal amount of distilled water. Run through a couple heating cooling cycles and recheck levels.

I have long since quit using Prestone anything.

 

[james49]

Originally Posted By: nutdriver


I have long since quit using Prestone anything.


What's wrong with Prestone? It was on sale at Walmart for $9 for an undiluted gal. with a $5 rebate. Since it listed ethylene glycol in its ingredients I bought it. My vehicle's manual just says to use ethylene glycol antifreeze. And it is a universal antifreeze. Maybe I should have found out the antifreeze's percentage of ethylene glycol. I couldn't find it on their website.

 

[SilverC6]

Peak has an old school "green" coolant.

I'd go with that.

A lot of the "lifetime" coolants out there like Prestone are just a Dex-clone of some sort.

I got my own 3.1 intake gasket experience going on too.

My 2001 Chevy Lumina went from the most reliable car in the fleet to a big question mark.

I'm still getting check engine lights on the EGR system and drivability problems even though the shop replaced the EGR valve.

Personally, I'm going with Peak Global Lifetime on everything I own.

 

[wgtoys]

Personally I would use Zerex G-05. It is a European style formulation which seems to be well thought out and shouldn't have any compatibility problems with systems designed for the traditional "green" coolant.

 

[rshaw125]

I have gradually converted all of my vehicles over to Peak Long Life.Using distilled water. No problems at all. I buy it when Ace hardware has it on sale. Works out less than $5 a gallon.
Its phosphate and silicate free.Mixes with everything and is good for 150,000 miles.

 

[Ken2]

First, keep in mind that just about every antifreeze is ethylene glycol based. The difference is in the anticorrosion chemicals. The only antifreezes that are not ethylene glycol are the ones clearly labeled as propylene glycol.

So, which antifreeze is right for your car? As others said, I'd pick any plain green AF and change it every two years. If you want a long life antifreeze, a Dex-Cool product is the one to use.

Here's Zerex's chart--note that they recommend against G-05 for Asian cars after '96.
http://www.valvoline.com/zerex/pdf/Zerex_CoolantChart.pdf?coaid=1B5D1AEA1AFC

By the way, weren't GM's problems due to shoddy (cheap) gaskets and shoddy (cheap) radiator caps, not Death-Cool itself? Yes, the Dex-Cool did react poorly with the shoddy parts.

 

[wavinwayne]

Originally Posted By: Ken2
...By the way, weren't GM's problems due to shoddy (cheap) gaskets and shoddy (cheap) radiator caps, not Death-Cool itself? Yes, the Dex-Cool did react poorly with the shoddy parts.


I've never seen any conclusive evidence that DexCool CAUSED any gasket problems, despite the claims by some that it "eats" gaskets.

 

[doitmyself]

TimH,

Has this discussion ended your confusion?

Based on my non-risk taking background, my vote is to VERIFY what's in there now and replace it with the same. This web site suggests that it is the conventional coolant:

http://hyundai-uae.com/uae/services/tips.html

I use the Zerex product:

http://www.valvoline.com/pages/products/product_detail.asp?product=8

Note that today's conventional "green" coolants are different than the "green snot of Death" products of years past. Today's product is low (vs. high)silicate. Zerex even says theirs is good for five years/100,00 miles (I wouldn't go that long).

Do you need to consider long warranties? Others will say fluid type doesn't matter, BUT my experience is that life is easier if you keep ALL your ducks in a row.

Good luck.

 

[Donald]

I would as others have said try and do a few flushes with distilled water and then either use a G-05 or Peak Global. While the old green antifreeze would also be fine I think it will be harder and harder to find.

You can get Peak Global at Walmart and either at NAPA.

 

[ZGRider]

Originally Posted By: wavinwayne
Originally Posted By: Ken2
...By the way, weren't GM's problems due to shoddy (cheap) gaskets and shoddy (cheap) radiator caps, not Death-Cool itself? Yes, the Dex-Cool did react poorly with the shoddy parts.


I've never seen any conclusive evidence that DexCool CAUSED any gasket problems, despite the claims by some that it "eats" gaskets.


Well then, read this article and look at the pics and make up your own mind. But before you make statements like that, do some real research and don't just make unimformed assumptions. All these compliants about Dexcool could not just be "bad gaskets" Too simplistic ! They are also the only OEM to use Dexcool. "Chicken or the egg?"
http://www.zillamotorsports.com/DEX/

 

[Donald]

The net is that in a perfect world where no air ever got into the system and it was changed as recommended, DexCool would be fine antifreeze. But its not a perfect world, GM has had more than its share of failed gaskets (for who knows what reason) letting in air and some problem with radiator caps that that leak and also let in air.

But given that DexCool is no better than G-05 antifreeze, nor cheaper and if you happen to get air into the system for any reason, then the DexCool will start to turn to sludge.

Why risk it when Dexcool has no advantages?

Except warranty issues.

PEAK Global could substitute for G-05.

 

[gmdriver]

Dexcool always seems to be a controversial subject. I was recently a bit alarmed to find out about the Dexcool fiasco after having recently purchased a new GM 2008 year vehicle that used Dexcool, and did read up on a lot of the problems that involved this coolant. However, it appeared that Dexcool problems primarily affected older GM vehicles with V-6 engines in years from around mid-90s to 2003 GM products that had the lower intake manifold, and because my new vehicle's 4-cylinder Ecotec engine has a different design, I was more relieved that any Dexcool risk would not be as applicable, it appears.

http://www.kmbc.com/video/15786643/index.html?rss=kc1&psp=video

In any case, I would consider replacing the factory loaded Dexcool coolant after about 3 years or so when this new car's full warranty runs out. Would Dexcool replacement absolutely require a complete drain and flush before refilling it with regular coolant? From what I understand there is no harm with a bit of Dexcool mixed with regular coolant, but I also read articles which warned about having the system thoroughly flushed first to eliminate traces of Dexcool before switching coolant. I read that the extra long life of any Dexcool mixed with regular coolant would result in the extra coolant life being lost. However, I am aware that supposedly only Dexcool should be added to an existing tank of Dexcool coolant if the system is not to be drained, i.e. I would not top off a tank of Dexcool with non-Dexcool without draining the system first before refilling it with another type of coolant. Thanks for any clarifications.

Originally Posted By: Donald
The net is that in a perfect world where no air ever got into the system and it was changed as recommended, DexCool would be fine antifreeze. But its not a perfect world, GM has had more than its share of failed gaskets (for who knows what reason) letting in air and some problem with radiator caps that that leak and also let in air.

 

[Propflux01]

Originally Posted By: doitmyself
Has this discussion ended your confusion?


Yes, it has settled some of the confusion. I think I will settle with Peak Global. reasonings include the following:

1. "Toyota Red", while probably an excellent coolant, can only be bought at Toyota dealers, and from what I am reading elsewhere, is not readily able to be mixed with others should something go wrong.

2. Regular Green 'standby' is getting ever harder to find.

3. The Zerex G-05 Is almost impossible to find around here it seems, and while the Zerex chart says to use it's Dex-Clone from 96-on, I am thinking that is mainly because of the Asian Cars 'Red' lifetime coolants and such, and I do not want a 'Dex-anything" in my radiator.

4. Dex-cool... Not.

5. Peak Global Is around everywhere here.

6. Sound like a plan?

 

[The Critic]

PEAK Long Life (in the blue jug with the orange cap) is the very similar to Death-Cool.

Peak Global Lifetime in the bronze jug is the one you're looking for.

As for the universal coolants and Dex-Cool, I have not had any problems with mine. I even installed it in my dad's Toyota van and I have not had any problems. Then again, I understand that others have not been so lucky.

 

[ZGRider]

Originally Posted By: Tim H.
Originally Posted By: doitmyself
Has this discussion ended your confusion?


Yes, it has settled some of the confusion. I think I will settle with Peak Global. reasonings include the following:

1. "Toyota Red", while probably an excellent coolant, can only be bought at Toyota dealers, and from what I am reading elsewhere, is not readily able to be mixed with others should something go wrong.

2. Regular Green 'standby' is getting ever harder to find.

3. The Zerex G-05 Is almost impossible to find around here it seems, and while the Zerex chart says to use it's Dex-Clone from 96-on, I am thinking that is mainly because of the Asian Cars 'Red' lifetime coolants and such, and I do not want a 'Dex-anything" in my radiator.

4. Dex-cool... Not.

5. Peak Global Is around everywhere here.

6. Sound like a plan?


Although G-05 from Zerex may be hard to find in some places, Mopar and Ford Gold antifreeze are both G-05 and hence plentiful. They are a little more expensive than Zerex, but it doesn't matter how cheap something is if it isn't available. If you want G-05, you now have no excuse not to use it.

 

[Donald]

I think Peak Global is fine and I would not beat the bushes to find a G-05.

 

[SZR48207]

Peak Global is good stuff. The only thing is it LACKS silicates, while some mfg like Ford call for silicates because they provide some cleaning action for the cooling system internals.

If your system needs silicates, but you use silicant-free coolant, do a yearly flush and fill.

(that's my logic, anyway)