Toyota T-IV = Dexron III ?

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I found this interesting TSB released by Toyota regarding their T-IV ATF:

http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/2000/Service Bulletins/tc001t02 ATF Fluid Requirements.pdf

TSB: TC001-02
Title:
AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID REQUIREMENTS
Models:
All ’00 – ’02 Models & ’03 Corolla & Matrix


MODEL----- 2000 -----|---- 2001 ----|---- 2002 ----|---- 2003
Corolla A131L, A245E | A131L, A245E | A131L, A245E | A245E
ATF----- DexronIII --|-- DexronIII -|-- DexronIII -|--- T-IV



Look at the row for the Corolla. The columns are the Aisin automatic transmission model numbers. Toyota recommends Dexron III in the A245E AT before and including 2002. However, Toyota goes to recommend Type T–IV in the SAME... I repeat the SAME 2003 Aisin A245E AT. There might be some very minor improvements in the AT from year to year. But I doubt anything significant enough to require an ATF with entirely different characteristics. Which leads me to conclude that T-IV is perhaps a higher grade Dexron III. I am speculating that they did this so they can promote their "life time ATF" to raise the Corolla value's because of less maintenance. And would also explain Toyota's naming convention (4 comes after 3) for their improved Dexron III+ ATF.

Here are a few after market ATFs that claim meets T-IV specs and the reason they meet T-IV is because they are already meet Dexron III specs... again this statement is sepeculation:

Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF

Mobil Multi-Vehicle

Mobil ATF 3309 (approved against Type T-IV, JWS 3309)

CASTROL Import Multi-Vehicle

PENNZOIL MULTI-VEHICLE

If the above is true then that would leave a lot full synthetic and synthetic blend alternatives for T-IV ATF users. I believe T-IV is still a conventional as people here and on other forums have stated.

Do YOU agree with what I said?
 
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I don't know... there's a lot of extrapolation from one small observation in there... I don't necessarily agree that Toyota should keep its customers to its own brand, but for what I pay for it it is really good value. down here it is close to the cheapest stuff... the aftermarket names claiming to meet T-IV specs are more expensive than T-IV from the dealer, so why bother?
 
Er, because you may want a better fluid? If I want a basic T-IV fluid that costs less than the dealer fluid, I will use one of 2 SuperTech ATF's at WM that list the spec. Otherwise I use Mobil 1 or Amsoil. All work very well.
 
Originally Posted By: sunfire
Which leads me to conclude that T-IV is perhaps a higher grade Dexron III. I am speculating that they did this so they can promote their "life time ATF" to raise the Corolla value's because of less maintenance. And would also explain Toyota's naming convention (4 comes after 3) for their improved Dexron III+ ATF.


Perhaps I am not following the paragraph above, but Type-IV is not a lifetime fluid. The Toyota WS (believe it stands for World Standard) is the fluid they claim is good for the life of the tranny.
 
Originally Posted By: crinkles
I don't know... there's a lot of extrapolation from one small observation in there... I don't necessarily agree that Toyota should keep its customers to its own brand, but for what I pay for it it is really good value. down here it is close to the cheapest stuff... the aftermarket names claiming to meet T-IV specs are more expensive than T-IV from the dealer, so why bother?


Well, T-IV is dino oil with dubious quality (gray color in 20000-30000 miles). Most replacements are synth with proven quality.

I like this info. I have left over Mobil 1 ATF from my previous car. I will go ahead and use it in my Corolla in the next ATF change (drain and refill I do every 30000 miles).
 
Royal Purple MaxATF also handles T-IV. I will run it in my tranny that calls for T-IV when I have the fluid changed.
 
Well, let's look at a couple of things here first.

1) The 2003 Corolla is the newer version of the Corolla. 2002 was the last year of the Corolla/Prism versions. So maybe Toyota made some changes to the Corolla/Matrix/Vibe tranny to require T-IV.

2) Mobil 1 is no longer DexronIII/Mercon, it's Mercon V now at least in my neck of the woods. And the bottle that Im holding in my hand as Im writing this doesn't say anythinhg about being used in a Toyota as a replacement for T-IV but can probably be used in Toyota auto trannys using Dexron.

I haven't seen any new Mobil 1 syn atf in my area that states what sunfire is saying. I do beleive sunfire and I would like to see/use this Mobil 1.
 
According to the Mobil 1 website their Mobil 1 ATF does not mention anything about Toyota T-IV so it should not be used. End of discussion.

Amsoil ATF does mention T-IV and should be an excellent choice if you want a top tier full synthetic.
 
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Well, let's look at a couple of things here first.

1) The 2003 Corolla is the newer version of the Corolla. 2002 was the last year of the Corolla/Prism versions. So maybe Toyota made some changes to the Corolla/Matrix/Vibe tranny to require T-IV.

2) Mobil 1 is no longer DexronIII/Mercon, it's Mercon V now at least in my neck of the woods. And the bottle that Im holding in my hand as Im writing this doesn't say anythinhg about being used in a Toyota as a replacement for T-IV but can probably be used in Toyota auto trannys using Dexron.

I haven't seen any new Mobil 1 syn atf in my area that states what sunfire is saying. I do beleive sunfire and I would like to see/use this Mobil 1.


I have 2003 corolla. The changes in engine mostly dealt with oil consumption (very common in 1998-2002 corollas) such as new oil rings and oil holes. I doubt there were significant changes in tranny, except for software and shifting points. Possible optimized for the new fluid.

As for Mobil 1 ATF suitable for T-IV is shown here:
http://www.mobil.com//USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil_1_Synthetic_ATF.asp

I doubt the formula changed regardless what is printed on the bottle.
 
Originally Posted By: Donald
According to the Mobil 1 website their Mobil 1 ATF does not mention anything about Toyota T-IV so it should not be used. End of discussion.

Amsoil ATF does mention T-IV and should be an excellent choice if you want a top tier full synthetic.


Quote:
Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF is also suitable for use in vehicles that specify the following fluid requirements:

Audi G 052 025-A2, G 052 162-A1
BMW LA2634
Esso LT 71141
ETL-7045E, ETL-8072B, N402
Ford* MERCON*, MERCON V, MERCON LV
All 2005 and earlier GM vehicles**
Honda ATF-Z1*
Hyundai SP-II, SP-III
Idemitsu K17
JWS 3309
Kia SP-II, SP-III
MAN 339F, V1, V2, Z1, Z2, Z3
Mazda ATF-III, ATF-MV
Mercedes-Benz 236.1, 236.2, 236.5, 236.6, 236.7, 236.9
Mitsubishi Diamond SP-II, SP-III
Nissan Matic-D, Matic-J, Matic-K
Subaru ATF
Toyota T-III, T-IV
Voith 55.6335.XX (G607, G1363),
Volvo 97340
ZF TE-ML 03D, 04D, 09, 14A, 14B, 16L, 17C


?
 
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Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: Donald
According to the Mobil 1 website their Mobil 1 ATF does not mention anything about Toyota T-IV so it should not be used. End of discussion.


It's not end of the discussion if you read here:
http://www.mobil.com//USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil_1_Synthetic_ATF.asp


Nice find, from what I remember, M1 ATF was not always a replacement for T-IV. Is this a new formulation? Who will be the first to try it?
 
This is very interesting. My understanding is that T-IV = Mobil 3309 ATF. And I was same understanding that Mobil 1 ATF was NOT a suitable substitute. Has this all changed ????
 
Based on the information, I believe T-IV is nothing more than a long drain Dexron III. M1 Syn ATF has been has always met DIII specs.
 
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek

I like this info. I have left over Mobil 1 ATF from my previous car. I will go ahead and use it in my Corolla in the next ATF change (drain and refill I do every 30000 miles).


Let us know how this works out for you.
 
Originally Posted By: Axe Man
This is very interesting. My understanding is that T-IV = Mobil 3309 ATF. And I was same understanding that Mobil 1 ATF was NOT a suitable substitute. Has this all changed ????


That is exactly how I understood it. I also remember reading that Mobil themselves said a few years ago that M1 ATF was not compatible with the Corolla/Vibe/Matrix auto tranny.
 
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...true#Post930540

2004 Toyota Tacoma Automatic Transmission Fluid
Originally Posted By: unDummy
T-III is Toyota's equivalent spec for DexronIII. Don't let anyone tell you its different.
T-IV added HFM smooth shifts, timing and slip control, and longer life additive package to the Dexron III spec. I've seen a bunch of dealers blindly use T-IV in place of DexronIII with no apparent ill effects. If anything, the transmission shifts better.

Since you can use Dexron III, just about any newer ATF can be used.

If you want to know if a fluid is marginal, just look at the UOAs. I don't think that there are ANY outstanding OEM ATF UOAs from ANY automaker. Not every transmission hits 200k with no problems. For eveyone vehicle that does, I'll find an owner with the same that smoked the tranny before 30k.

If money isn't an issue, use any of the full synthetic ATFs. Mobil1 and RoyalPurple are easy store finds these days. Redline D4, Amsoil ATF/ATD,.... and others can be found online easy enough. Dexron VI is al$o a choice.

If you want a cost effective upgrade to the DexronIII, any Mercon-V or other blended synth multivehicle ATF can be used.

Since DexronIII/Mercon licensing has expired and isn't tested/police'd by Ford/Gm anymore, some members are wrongly created 'fear' against the new equivalents. If you do use a cheap Dex/Merc equivalent, stick with one of the name brand fluids. Another option is the TES-389 certified fluids, which mimics the DexronIII-H/Mercon specs.

Adjust your ATF OCI based on transmisison family history, driving style, fluid chosen, upgrades performed, and flush type at your intervals.
 
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