Originally Posted By: azsynthetic
Originally Posted By: jpr
So by my point of view, the choice is pretty straightforward, either choose an oil that:
(1) has had its chemical properties and performance tested and approved by API, ACE, BMW, MB, and likely others
- or -
(2) an oil that carries no independent test certifications and offers no apparent offsetting properties in performance or price
I can really see no advantage in trading the sure thing of choice 1 for the uncertainty inherent in choice 2. Others of course will feel differently, such as the league of mixologists around here.
Like I have said above, the reason that you can not see any advantage with non API/ACEA/etc oil is that you do not look beyond the manufacturer recommendation for warranty purposes. Your choice in item 1 is to basically maintain your engine warranty, no more no less. No one compete professionally with their factory stock Corvette, Viper, Porsche, Ferrari, etc. is using OEM recommended oils for those car, why? Redline, Amsoil, Klotz etc. have extensive racing programs to develop and test their oils and their oils will outperform any OEM recommended oils, albeit at a higher price point. Redline race oil will outperform pretty much any OEM street oil on the market, and their street oil IS their race oil plus detergent. No OEM oil has ever given me better fuel mileage than Redline and you would not know it unless you have tried it. The saving in fuel is more than made up for the increase in cost.
If all you want is to maintain your warranty then by all means follow the OEM recommended specifications. But, if you are looking at severe duty or extended OCI on your vehicles then the boutique oils are better choices, and you would not know it unless you abuse it. Take your daily driver to the track and see if it survive a full day of auto-cross on the OEM oil.
For a typical going to work car or grocery getter then I recommend either the Val Synpower or PP at $1/qt after rebate. For a high dollar toy car or a work horse I would recommend Amsoil, Redline, Royal Purple, etc. for the added insurance.
You seem awfully confident that you know more about my thinking that I do.
To get a few things out of the way -
* yes, race oils are different than street oils. They are subjected to different conditions and have different needs. The oil is typically also changed after each event.
* yes, the oil I'm talking about is humble "street" oil. Daily and year round use has it's own demands and conditions different from race oils, and I'm pretty sure there's more to it than simply dumping in some detergent
* I've made no mention of warranty concerns. Heck, my car has been out of warranty of about 5 years and 40k+ miles.
Perhaps I'm not a "hard-core" oil guy because I look at oil as something upon which I need but not want to spend money. Oil is just a tool to me, not a source of pride or prestige. While there is definitely a distinction between cheap tools and quality tools, once past a certain performance threshold, I see no value in having it gold plated.
My interest and opinions of oils is strictly data driven. An API certification supplies data. For example, if an oil is SM rated instead of SL, I know that it is required to have a phosphorous content between 0.06% and 0.08% and has a lower max deposit weight on the TEOST MHT-4 test. If it is ACEA A3 rated, I know it has a higher HTHS value than either the A1 or A5 oils.
In the case of either API or ACEA rating, I know that the oil has been subjected to a battery of both lab and engine tests and met the approval criteria. I may not know the exact test results, but I do know that properties of the oil, such as EOWTT, EOFT, gelation, oil/elastomer compatibility, chlorine content, volatilty, foaming tendencies, high temp deposits, cam wear, piston cleanliness, sludge formation, etc. have been deemed acceptable. Manufacturer's tests take this an additional step further, repeating many of the engine tests on their own equipment rather than the ASTM or CEC standard test engines. All in all, a whole lot of information is provided on an oil through just a few short acronyms.
The catch with the "boutique" oils is that comparable information is simply not available. They generally do not carry any ratings nor do they provide a comparable amount of data from which one could make their own evaluation. Generally speaking, the data they do provide is rarely independent, usually cherry-picked, and sometimes presented in a rather misleading fashion. And I simply do consider anecdotes, testimonials, celebrity endorsement, or "try it you'll like it" to be convincing arguments let alone data.
So when faced with a choice between oils about which I have data regarding their properties and performance and oils about which I have little to no such information, I see no compelling reason to accept that uncertainty. To my engineering mind, uncertainty means risk. To my management mind, the first rule of risk management is "accept no unnecessary risk." With the variety of high quality oils out there that do carry certifications and approvals, it's just simply not necessary to consider those that don't.