Mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum???

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Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
.... revved higher during freeway driving then some of the synthetic blends I have used. .....give me better mileage, rev lower ....


Hooey! Revs (rpm) is a matter of gearing and speed. Your OIL cannot make any difference there.
 
Did we not have a discussion some time ago that the higher the density of an oil, the better the UOA?

Mobil 5w-40 ~ 0.86
Mobil 5w-30 ~ 0.81
Mobil 5w-30 EP ~ 0.85

Anybody know the numbers for Penzoil?
 
Viscosity Grade.
0W-20
5W-20
5W-30
10W-30
API Service
SM
SM
SM/CF
SM/CF
ILSAC
GF-4
GF-4
GF-4
GF-4
ACEA
A1-02
A1-02
A5/B5
A5/B5*
Gravity, °API
ASTM D-287
34.8
34.38
33.8
33.3
Specific Gravity @ 60°F(15.6°C)
ASTM D-287
0.851
0.852
0.856
0.859

Data from the Pennzoil Platinum data sheet.
 
Originally Posted By: blueiedgod
Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
I can tell it revs higher not due some butt dyno but looking at the RPMs and seeing that with full syn, the car revs at around 2500 RPMs at the same speed(around 80 mph) and with syn blends, it revs at 2000-2100 rpms and the power felt the same as in it would rev faster with the lower rpm and rev slower at the higher RPM with full syns.


I am not completley knocking down your theory, but if your engine revs at different RPM's at the same speed before and after an oil change, I would check the transmission. Unless you have a CVT tranny (which by the vehicle in your signature, you don't) You are looking at a slipping tranny. The gear ratios are fixed and do not adjust based on the engine output. If you are cruising in 5th OD at 2500 RPM before the oil change and at 2000 RPM after the oil change at the same speed, your tranny is toast.


Ah cork it. My car is super sensitive, that's all. It does this kinda stuff all the time. heh

You wanna put money where your pie consumer is? You say my tranny is toast, right doc? Well then how many miles do 'i' have then? :> We can do it by miles, months or a combo of both, take yer pick.. And how much are we betting? (Fyi: I am at 42,700 roughly miles). Go ahead < > make my day and new year!

If you don't wanna wager money, we can simply do it for your pride and soul on BITOG. That might be more 'priceless' !
 
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It's NOT your transmission that is gorked. It's also impossible for engine oil to change your rpm's at a given speed in a given gear at a given load.
 
Hey guys, can I jump in here with a question that may bring us back on target?

Which of these two oils will do a better job of keeping the engine clean on the inside - I'm talking varnish and sludge etc.

There was a time when I would say Mobil 1 was best at this, but I have seen a few pics of engine vitals after long term M1 useage and there was plenty of varnish to go around.

I have no idea of how a PP engine looks inside after 100k miles. Has anyone here torn down a hi mileage PP engine?

Both oils are very good and the price difference is a wash, so maybe the deciding factor should be engine cleanliness. Just a thought! Cheers & Happy New Year all!!DV
 
double v: do you think the varnish was harmful? If you're tearing down an engine that had a steady diet of Mobil 1, was it due to any lubrication-related issues, or were you just doing modifications? I'm not sure a "staining" would mean bad things were going on, but, when I hear "varnish", I picture an actual coating that can be flaked off or removed with a solvent...which I would think would be bad.
 
Quote:
Has anyone here torn down a hi mileage PP engine?


It hasn't been in its current formulation long enough to have been out there that long on too many engines. They had a banging new process base stock EOP (IIRC) ..probably spent quite a few million in R&D ..then (seemed like) overnight went back to Group III commonality. That's when the paper shredder commercial came out (or that "rebuilding" ad campaign). I think that was around 2003. Anyone with 100k on the current PP would surely be a frequent flyer and probably not be prone to deposits/varnish unless some engine design flaw was present.
 
Originally Posted By: MatchboxCar
Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
.... revved higher during freeway driving then some of the synthetic blends I have used. .....give me better mileage, rev lower ....


Hooey! Revs (rpm) is a matter of gearing and speed. Your OIL cannot make any difference there.


the only thing thats hooey is that you dont (and might not ever) know that everything is tighter in a Japanese car...with whatever you got..and that's why there's no need to go Korean et al.
 
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Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Hey 06Vtec, maybe of you put some Bruceblend Lite 0w-10 in your car, you'll be able to run in NHRA Top Fuel.


hmm, don't encourage me ;> when it comes to this kinda tutelage..
 
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Originally Posted By: mpvue
I heard that used oil from a honda V6 cures cancer.



Along with the tears of Chuck Norris.
 
Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
Originally Posted By: blueiedgod
Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
I can tell it revs higher not due some butt dyno but looking at the RPMs and seeing that with full syn, the car revs at around 2500 RPMs at the same speed(around 80 mph) and with syn blends, it revs at 2000-2100 rpms and the power felt the same as in it would rev faster with the lower rpm and rev slower at the higher RPM with full syns.


I am not completley knocking down your theory, but if your engine revs at different RPM's at the same speed before and after an oil change, I would check the transmission. Unless you have a CVT tranny (which by the vehicle in your signature, you don't) You are looking at a slipping tranny. The gear ratios are fixed and do not adjust based on the engine output. If you are cruising in 5th OD at 2500 RPM before the oil change and at 2000 RPM after the oil change at the same speed, your tranny is toast.


Ah cork it. My car is super sensitive, that's all. It does this kinda stuff all the time. heh

You wanna put money where your pie consumer is? You say my tranny is toast, right doc? Well then how many miles do 'i' have then? :> We can do it by miles, months or a combo of both, take yer pick.. And how much are we betting? (Fyi: I am at 42,700 roughly miles). Go ahead < > make my day and new year!

If you don't wanna wager money, we can simply do it for your pride and soul on BITOG. That might be more 'priceless' !


I don't know if you have a V6 with automatic (cough, girly, cough), although Honda did make the V6 with 6 spd in the coupe and sedan for the previous generation...

If you used anything other than Honda ATF Z-1 in that slush box, then yes, your tranny is toast. No matter how tight and sensitive Honda may be, there simply no way that the engine would rev differently at the same speed and gear just because of the oil.

But, I don't own a Honda with Automatic, which kinid of defies logic, since Honda makes the best revving engines, and automtics kill any kind of advantage you get out of the high revving engine, so I can't be 100% sure. I just know that by design, an engine and non-CVT tranny will rev at the same RPM at a given speed in a given gear, regardless of what is in the crankcase.

If you have a manual shifted Honda V6, first of all, more props to you. Second, if you see different RPM's at the same speed in the same gear, then you are looking at oil leaking onto the clutch, or just a slipping clutch.
 
I had a honda once, but w/ synthetic, time actually slowed down and I was always late for work. I had to park on the side of the road just so the orbit of the earth could catch up.
 
Originally Posted By: blueiedgod
Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
Originally Posted By: blueiedgod
Originally Posted By: 06VtecV6
I can tell it revs higher not due some butt dyno but looking at the RPMs and seeing that with full syn, the car revs at around 2500 RPMs at the same speed(around 80 mph) and with syn blends, it revs at 2000-2100 rpms and the power felt the same as in it would rev faster with the lower rpm and rev slower at the higher RPM with full syns.


I am not completley knocking down your theory, but if your engine revs at different RPM's at the same speed before and after an oil change, I would check the transmission. Unless you have a CVT tranny (which by the vehicle in your signature, you don't) You are looking at a slipping tranny. The gear ratios are fixed and do not adjust based on the engine output. If you are cruising in 5th OD at 2500 RPM before the oil change and at 2000 RPM after the oil change at the same speed, your tranny is toast.


Ah cork it. My car is super sensitive, that's all. It does this kinda stuff all the time. heh

You wanna put money where your pie consumer is? You say my tranny is toast, right doc? Well then how many miles do 'i' have then? :> We can do it by miles, months or a combo of both, take yer pick.. And how much are we betting? (Fyi: I am at 42,700 roughly miles). Go ahead < > make my day and new year!

If you don't wanna wager money, we can simply do it for your pride and soul on BITOG. That might be more 'priceless' !


I don't know if you have a V6 with automatic (cough, girly, cough), although Honda did make the V6 with 6 spd in the coupe and sedan for the previous generation...

If you used anything other than Honda ATF Z-1 in that slush box, then yes, your tranny is toast. No matter how tight and sensitive Honda may be, there simply no way that the engine would rev differently at the same speed and gear just because of the oil.

But, I don't own a Honda with Automatic, which kinid of defies logic, since Honda makes the best revving engines, and automtics kill any kind of advantage you get out of the high revving engine, so I can't be 100% sure. I just know that by design, an engine and non-CVT tranny will rev at the same RPM at a given speed in a given gear, regardless of what is in the crankcase.

If you have a manual shifted Honda V6, first of all, more props to you. Second, if you see different RPM's at the same speed in the same gear, then you are looking at oil leaking onto the clutch, or just a slipping clutch.


I guess I would have to change my oil back to pp and get on the freeway and demonstrate to everyone that 'Look, see the RPms at 2500 @ 80 mph??' Then drain it and put what I use now, the CP stuff and say 'look, see my rpms at 2100 to 2200 @ 80 mph??' I couldn't even make this type of stuff up people, as you all knooooooow, I am a serious newb and post some pretty wild stuff (although not at the level of Merkava.. ;0) Thanks for posting. I take it you had a happy new year. Regards.
 
Originally Posted By: blueiedgod


If you used anything other than Honda ATF Z-1 in that slush box, then yes, your tranny is toast.


are you so sure? is there any evidence of this? maybe you can try convincing people in the ATF, Differential, Trans, Brake, P/S section that Z-1 is the only way to go.
 
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double vanos... I can tell you this: I've used nothing but M1 on my two Hondas and when I take off the oil filler cap on the valve covers, I always look inside and even shine a flashlight in there and the metal has never shown or has had any type of varnish on it. Still looks like it was just machined yesterday. My older car, a 1990 Olds V6, but using dino PP, had a lot of varnish on it, but that engine never used any oil right up until I sold it at 210K miles.
 
Back to engine cleanliness....I had a '92 Chevy PU that suffered a broken valve spring @ 92,000 miles (think 90s GM quality). Used Mobil 1 in it since new.
When I opened her up to do the repairs, everything was gun metal grey - I mean spotless.

Recently I saw pictures of a Las Vegas taxi with high mileage that was a M1 engine; varnish city!!! I think it was here that I saw it. Made me stop and take pause as far as considering M1 to be a great oil.

I realize that the taxis in Las Vegas are subjected to tremendous heat, but then my PU resided in Houston where the summers can get fairly hot. I was not impressed.

I guess I'm asking if PP, being a GRP III oil product, and usually having very good UOA's, is known to keep engines clean. If so, why even use M1? It's a buck or two higher a 5qt jug than PP and while I usually don't balk at that now I'm changing oil every 3.5k in a Mazdaspeed 3 so the costs add up over time.

So nobody's had to open a PP engine up for a repair?

A peep at the cams on the Speed 3 show PP to be doing a good job of keeping the innards clean but it hasn't endured a Houston summer yet and only has 7k miles on the clock.

I think I'll turn it into a PP ginea pig a see if it varnishes up over time. Then we'll know. Cheers all! DV
 
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