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#1017401 - 10/25/07 03:53 AM Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 mi
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
This is my neighbor’s 2003 Ferrari Enzo with a total of 8,800 miles on the left column and my 2003 Enzo with a total of 3,000 miles on the right column. Both cars had 1,400 miles on the oil. His obviously had more break-in time. He had the oil changed by the Ferrari dealer using the required 10W60 Shell Helix Ultra Racing oil. I ran 0W30 Castrol GC.

The recommended interval is 5,000 miles, less if on the track. This is strictly off track use in town and on the highway, probably 50-50 for his car and 90 percent city for me.

His oil was tested by: youroil.net, while I got the full, total evaluation from Terry Dyson.
................................................................................................................

_____________Shell....GC
Iron___________ 32...11
Chromium _____<1...0
Nickel ___­_______ 2...1
Aluminum ______11...3
lead __________ 16...0
Copper ________25...8
Tin ___________<1...0
Silver ________<.1...0
Titanium ______<1...0
Silicon _________ 7...3
Boron __________ 1...3
Sodium ________ 8...3
Potassium ____<10...0
Molybdenum __ <5...1
Phosphorus __1026...935
Zinc ________ 1135...1228
Calcium _____ 1454...1671
Barium _______<10...0
Magnesium ___1219...526
Antimony _____<30...0
Vanadium ______<1...0
Fuel %Vol _____<1...1.2
Abs Oxid ______34...10
Abs Nitr _______11...8
Wtr %vol ______<0.1...KF=247 “nice dry fluid”
Vis CS 100C __ 15.8...11.8
Vic CS 40C___not done...66
SAE Grade _­___40...30
Gly test ______NEG...0.37 “not antifreeze”
TBN _________not done...7.9


aehaas


Edited by G-MAN (10/25/07 06:04 AM)

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#1017402 - 10/25/07 04:00 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 mi [Re: AEHaas]
JAG Offline


Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 4532
Loc: Fredericksburg, VA
What have oil temps been like?
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#1017403 - 10/25/07 04:27 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: JAG]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
Once I got the oil up to 190 F when I just kept the engine at 8 grand for a while. Otherwise it never got over 180 F. Terry says that the way the fuel is calculated may, if anything, be an underestimate. He stated that the engine seemed be be the most efficient he has seen in terms of burning the fuel. This makes sense as they get 650 BHP out of the 6.0 liter engine without any turbos or compressors.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017404 - 10/25/07 05:06 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
SubLGT Offline


Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 1809
Loc: Idaho
Looks like your neighbor's Enzo has a lot more bearing and cylinder wear than your Enzo. Does he abuse his motor, or is the extra wear due to the 10W60?

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#1017405 - 10/25/07 05:10 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
SubLGT Offline


Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 1809
Loc: Idaho
Quote:

.........Terry says that the way the fuel is calculated may, if anything, be an underestimate. He stated that the engine seemed be be the most efficient he has seen in terms of burning the fuel. This makes sense as they get 650 BHP out of the 6.0 liter engine without any turbos or compressors.

aehaas




1.2% fuel in the oil does not strike me as being "most efficient". What am I missing here?

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#1017406 - 10/25/07 05:15 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: SubLGT]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
"1.2% fuel in the oil does not strike me as being "most efficient". What am I missing here?"

The efficiency is in the other numbers, some not seen here. The interpretation is proprietary so I cannot give the details. It is part of the superiority of a full Dyson analysis.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017407 - 10/25/07 06:11 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
kd5byb Offline


Registered: 01/25/07
Posts: 645
Loc: Huntsville, AL
Seems to me that this is some good, albeit circumstantial evidence that thicker oil doesn't necessarily protect better. Especially considering the highway/city mileage difference between the two favoring the Enzo with the thicker oil.

I love Ferrari's - when I was growing up, a neighbor down the road had either a 308 or 328 - can't really remember exactly which. Fantastic looking, fantastic sounding, and I can only imagine that it drove fantastic as well.

Always enjoyable reading about such neat vehicles.

Thanks much!
-ben
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'97 Mustang 4.6L, '02 Lancer 2.0L, '07 Tundra 5.7L.
Please excuse typos - have an 8 year old son running around creating endless havoc... wink

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#1017408 - 10/25/07 07:02 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: kd5byb]
LargeCarManX2 Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 2279
Loc: Up here in the NorthWest
Although the 0-30 produced lower wear numbers, the 10-60 is in the normal range and posted good numbers. The Helix got beat up a bit looking at the oxid and final weight of the oil.

I would like to see what Amsoils newest signature oil would do in these engines? I guess your running the apple juice oil now it will be interesting what numbers you come up with
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"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm."
– Sir Winston Churchill

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#1017409 - 10/25/07 08:02 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: LargeCarManX2]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
"Looks like your neighbor's Enzo has a lot more bearing and cylinder wear than your Enzo. Does he abuse his motor, or is the extra wear due to the 10W60? "

We drive the same streets but sometimes he does not wait long enough before stepping on the gas. In any event the ambient temperatures are rarely below 60 F even in the winter.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017410 - 10/25/07 10:00 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
SubLGT Offline


Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 1809
Loc: Idaho
Does your Enzo now have the RLI 0W20 in it?

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#1017411 - 10/25/07 10:45 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: SubLGT]
Lonnie Offline


Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 2304
Loc: Los Angles, CA
Why did the Shell take such a big shot in the viscosity?

Did you do a really careful break-in? If so what did you do? By the looks of things the oil did not do everything, you must have been involved there somewhere?

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#1017412 - 10/25/07 01:58 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: Lonnie]
INDYMAC Offline


Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2330
Loc: Magnolia, TX
From what I understand, Ferrari breaks the car in at the racetrack before they deliver it to the customer. I think they carefully use WOT the whole way around the track though.
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#1017413 - 10/25/07 03:24 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: INDYMAC]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
My neighbor and I are the second owners of our cars. Both saw track time by the original owners. Ferrari breaks the engines in before they go in the cars. Each engine is dyno tested for appropriate BHP. If it does not make the minimum required then they do not go in the car.

Later each car is track tested at the factory. If you go to Maranello, the factory site, you will see cars going back and forth to the test track - through town. Each car has 50 - 100 miles on them when they leave the factory. They really get a workout.

When it comes to viscosity loss I have seen many of these 5 and 10W -- 50 and 60's lose viscosity much faster than others having less of a spread. This may be planned from the start. One has to wonder.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017414 - 10/25/07 03:36 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
Pablo Offline


Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 46681
Loc: Duvall WA - Pacific NW USA
That 10W-60 has a LOT of VII's in the form of polymeric thickeners. Not good for the engine, lubrication or the oil. Shell sponsors Ferrari for good monetary reasons. But when I get my Ferrari I wouldn't use that oil. Not only did it shear, I'm thinking it's possible that it could be leaving deposits on the ring lands.

One of these days I hope you will try Amsoil, Dr. Haas. You seem to shy away from it for some reason. Redline, RLI, GC......their reputation is somehow, better?

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#1017415 - 10/25/07 05:26 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: Pablo]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
In the past some of the Amsoil products thickened too soon for me. I always look for thinning or stability for start up viscosities, this is better than thickening for me. The current products all seem to be usable to me.

One reason I use other oils is that I have contacts within the oil companies that can answer questions. Dave at Red Line is an example. If he does not know the answer to a question he gets the answer then calls me back. I have gotten to know the people over at RLI and I am impressed with the room temperature characteristics of their motor oils. The numbers look good on paper too. This is why I will be trying their oils next.

Formulations seem to change weekly for motor oils. One has to stay on top of it.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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