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#1017416 - 10/25/07 05:36 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 28968
Loc: NJ
Quote:

Formulations seem to change weekly for motor oils. One has to stay on top of it.




Most definitely.

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#1017417 - 10/25/07 06:19 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: buster]
G-MAN Online   content


Registered: 11/15/02
Posts: 8763
Loc: SC
Based on this UOA there is no way I'd use Helix 10w60 in anything I own, much less a million dollar Enzo.

GC has no VI improvers to shear, hence its rock solid shear stability. I think Amsoil ACD would be a good choice for these cars under the conditions in which they get driven.
_________________________
2010 Audi A4 2.0T Quattro: Castrol Edge 0w40
2008 Ford Taurus X: MaxLife 5w20; MaxLife ATF

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#1017418 - 10/25/07 06:22 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: G-MAN]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 28968
Loc: NJ
Quote:

I think Amsoil ACD would be a good choice for these cars under the conditions in which they get driven.





I agree. Most of Amsoil's oils use very little VII's and when they do, they use high quality VII's. ASM 0w-20 I don't think uses any at all.

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#1017419 - 10/25/07 08:31 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: buster]
Lonnie Offline


Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 2304
Loc: Los Angles, CA
I was involved in the rebuild of an F40 motor and inside the motor was evidence that it was built by a craftsman. On the block casting there was not a rough edge inside, anywhere. The rods were matched, in that the forgings did not have small pads at either end to be ground on to match weight. The grinding to get the weight was carefully done around the big and small ends and very little of that was required. Each rod was a thing of beauty. Every stud had exactly the same amount of threads exposed above the nuts, evidence of hand labor by someone that cared about his work. One stud that went into a blind hole and stuck up about 20 thou too much. Rather than deepen the hole and cause a problem or shorten a carefully made stud with rolled threads and smoothed ends the mechanic use a thicker washer that exposed threads to the right height. This was noted on the build sheet. The casting surfaces behind a galley plug were deburred, shiny and smooth to the touch. The plug itself has rolled threads and was itself deburred and installed flush with a dab of paint bridging across the plug to the block. We actually talked to the guy that built the engine at the factory and he sent us a copy of his build sheet for that exact engine and later he called back to ask how the rework went. He also sent us some go/no-go gauges used in putting the engine back together and a list of notes and tips on assembling the engine. All this for a car built in the late 80's.

I would love to see the inside of your Enzo engine. If the F50 was the replacement for the F40 and the Enzo the replacement for the F50 I would sure like to see the replacement for the Enzo. I did not like the looks of the Enzo in pictures too much but that changed when I saw one in person and was taken for a ride. They say the way to a man's heart is through his stomach but, and don't take the wrong, but if you have an Enzo the way to your heart gets detoured to your ears and the seat of your pants.

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#1017420 - 10/25/07 10:15 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 mi [Re: AEHaas]
benjamming Offline


Registered: 01/03/04
Posts: 5656
Loc: northern Alabama
What was flashpoint?

What method does youroil.net use for water (assume not Karl Fischer) & fuel (assume not FTIR)?

What was TAN and sulfate byproducts? I don't know if youroil.net does these tests in a typical UOA.

What filters were used on both? OEM oil & air?

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#1017421 - 10/26/07 12:42 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: benjamming]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
“What was flashpoint?
What method does youroil.net use for water (assume not Karl Fischer) & fuel (assume not FTIR)?
What was TAN and sulfate byproducts? I don't know if youroil.net does these tests in a typical UOA.
What filters were used on both? OEM oil & air? “

These are good questions indeed.
The flashpoint was very low indicative of more fuel in the oil than indicated by the test values, both oil samples probably had more fuel in there than indicated.
I do not know the test methods used by youroil.net.
The TAN in my sample was very high at 1.71. This may be a better indicator than TBN and I am happy that DysonAnalysis does this. It is possible that TBN is high but cannot neutralize all the different types of acids building up in your engine. Some of my iron may in fact be secondary to the acid effects. I believe that TAN is much better than TBN for really seeing what is happening in your engine.
The only other value on my report was Soot = 0.

Both cars use the OEM parts all the way, except me, when it comes to the oil.

I use YourOil for basic testing as it is cheaper. When I need to really know what is going on I use DysonAnalysis. You may pay more with Dyson but you get much more in return.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017422 - 10/26/07 02:11 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
benjamming Offline


Registered: 01/03/04
Posts: 5656
Loc: northern Alabama
What is the TAN for virgin GC?

The sulfate byproduts # is listed in the lower right box of the reports from Dyson. Again, I don't know what the sulfate byproducts # is for virgin GC although I would expect it to be low.

What fuel & grade do you use? Any fuel additives?

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#1017423 - 10/26/07 02:17 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: benjamming]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
Sulfate By Product = 14

I use premium Exxon or Mobil gas, no additives.

aehaas
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017424 - 10/26/07 02:26 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
AEHaas Offline


Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1312
Loc: Sarasota, Florida
Here is a VOA from 2003, not sure if this is any help. The lab was not named.
Basically, this is useless in my mind but here it is:

Iron 3.4
Lead 0.5
Al 1.7
Copper 0.4
Silicon 7.8
Chromium 0.1
Nickel 0
Titanium 0.1
Silver 3.4
Tin 0
Sodium 0
Potassium 0
Boron 5.2
Barium 0.1
Moly 0.1
Magnesium 144
Calcium 3544
Phosphorus 896
Zinc 1116
Manganese 0.8
Vanadium 0
VI 180
Vis at 40c 67.6
Vis at 100c 12.2 (nice!)
TBN D4739 9.39
TAN 1.95
Pour point To Come
Freeze point -39
_________________________
Machine Guns.
Sarasota Home Inspections.

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#1017425 - 10/26/07 03:11 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
Patman Offline



Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 19195
Loc: Oakville, Ontario
That GC VOA was mine, it was done at Wearcheck Canada, and it was the green formula of GC, not the current gold formula.
_________________________
2005 Corvette (M1 5w30 & Fram Ultra)
2006 Civic EX Coupe (M1 0w20 & Fram Ultra)
2006 Jetta 2.5 (M1 0w40, Purolater filter)


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#1017426 - 10/26/07 06:01 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: AEHaas]
Pablo Offline


Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 46414
Loc: Duvall WA - Pacific NW USA
Quote:

In the past some of the Amsoil products thickened too soon for me. I always look for thinning or stability for start up viscosities, this is better than thickening for me. The current products all seem to be usable to me.

One reason I use other oils is that I have contacts within the oil companies that can answer questions. Dave at Red Line is an example. If he does not know the answer to a question he gets the answer then calls me back. I have gotten to know the people over at RLI and I am impressed with the room temperature characteristics of their motor oils. The numbers look good on paper too. This is why I will be trying their oils next.

Formulations seem to change weekly for motor oils. One has to stay on top of it.

aehaas




I appreciate that - but Amsoil will chat with you as well. If you want to move up the food chain in Amsoil and talk to the leaders or wait for an answer the next day from me, that's good too. When have I not answered a question? Maybe a thread I missed or something. Anyway thanks.

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#1017427 - 10/28/07 03:20 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: Pablo]
DmanWho Offline


Registered: 07/26/07
Posts: 578
Loc: Oregon
It would be hard to use another brand or weight of oil, in your new Enzo , than the one recommended by Ferrari! If your neighbor decides to continue running the Shell, this is a great opportunity for more comparisons. Unfortunately for us here, seeking more oil knowledge, I foresee your neighbor having you doing his future OC's.

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#1017428 - 10/28/07 03:41 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: benjamming]
JohnBrowning Offline


Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 9448
Loc: USA
I do not think many would argue that 10W60 is a bit much for round town driveing!!! I would never recomend 10W60 for that type of use and many consider me a thick oil man!!! It is not needed... I do have a question for you though... When did GC pick up so many additives????Origanaly when GC was makeing a name for it's self one of the things that was ungiue to it's formula was the low level's of metalic additives. Now it appear's to be loaded with ZDDP????When did this happen????

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#1017429 - 10/29/07 06:46 PM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: JohnBrowning]
02zx9r Offline


Registered: 07/05/07
Posts: 3205
Loc: Ball, LA
Dr,
have you ever considered doing the ferrari driving experience?

http://www.experienceferrari.com
_________________________
2012 Honda Insight EX





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#1017430 - 10/30/07 06:03 AM Re: Enzo (2) Compare Shell 10W60, GC 0W30 at 1,400 [Re: 02zx9r]
Geoff Offline


Registered: 05/16/04
Posts: 543
Loc: Austin, TX
Hard to argue with the results that the Castrol 0w-30 is a better choice. Does this engine run a lot of oil pressure? I am wondering if the high revs kicks in the bypass with the higher visc oil.

You probably need the 30 grade with the fuel dilute. What was the conclusion on the 5w-20 or was that with a different engine/car?
_________________________
2013 Chevy Camaro LS3/NPP
2008 Chevy Suburban
2004 Land Rover Discovery
2007 Supra 22V

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