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#1007236 - 10/09/07 06:29 PM How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oil?
rakuentw Offline


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 17
Loc: taiwan
Hello friends,I'm a new user come from Taiwan.
(I'm a Chinese ,with poor English)
In Taiwan,4T scooter motocycles are very popular transportations.

we usually bike 5 miles ~ 20 miles in once
somebody used 5w40,10w40,15w40,5w50,10w50 or 10w60
in their motocycle ; mineral,semi or full synthetic
;$2/Quart.~$33/Liter

motocycle's manual suggests use 15w-40/API SG Engine oil.
change oil every 1000KM(625 miles),
these scooters' oil capacity is about 800~1000 milliliters

I used Chevron supreme 10w40(mineral) now.
($2/Qt. in Taiwan costo),change oil every 700KM(438 miles)

can you tell me what is the best strategy
to choose engine oil for 4T scooter?

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#1007237 - 10/09/07 06:50 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oil? [Re: rakuentw]
Tree Hugger Offline


Registered: 02/23/04
Posts: 336
Loc: White House, TN USA
I don't see any point in using synthetic in that engine, The maker's reccomended oil change interval seems a little short for a 1 litre oil capacity - that would be about equivalent to a 3,000 mile (5,000 Km) on a normal car over here.
That would be well within Chevron Supreme's capability, even the SG rating. If you are actually getting SM rated oil now, I wouldn't hesitate to extend it to 1500 KM or even 2,000 KM.
For sure, 1,000 KM on Chevron Supreme SM would be perfectly safe....
_________________________
'03 Chevy Avalanche Z-71 on Havoline 5W30 for about 9,000 mile OCIs (per OLM).
'01 BMW R1100R Motorcycle on M1 15W-50 and ST 75W-145.

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#1007238 - 10/09/07 07:08 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: Tree Hugger]
rakuentw Offline


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 17
Loc: taiwan
in Taiwan,
scooter bikers usually change their engine oil every 1000 KM.
(few body changes every 600~800KM)
and change car's engine oil every 5000KM(3125 miles)-just full synthetic oil.
If our car used mineral oil, we changed every 3000KM(1875miles).

many people thought expensive =better

PS.i have had the experience use MOTUL 300V 15W50($15/Liter)
and change every 1000KM in my scooter

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#1007239 - 10/09/07 07:16 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: rakuentw]
Pablo Offline


Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 46408
Loc: Duvall WA - Pacific NW USA
Quote:

Hello friends,I'm a new user come from Taiwan.
(I'm a Chinese ,with poor English)
In Taiwan,4T scooter motocycles are very popular transportations.

we usually bike 5 miles ~ 20 miles in once
somebody used 5w40,10w40,15w40,5w50,10w50 or 10w60
in their motocycle ; mineral,semi or full synthetic
;$2/Quart.~$33/Liter

motocycle's manual suggests use 15w-40/API SG Engine oil.
change oil every 1000KM(625 miles),
these scooters' oil capacity is about 800~1000 milliliters

I used Chevron supreme 10w40(mineral) now.
($2/Qt. in Taiwan costo),change oil every 700KM(438 miles)

can you tell me what is the best strategy
to choose engine oil for 4T scooter?




Your English is fine. I am very familiar with scooters in Taiwan as I spent 5 years in and out of Taiwan, HK and mainland China. I suspect many have very loose engines by the smell and visual smoke clouds. The 15W-40 seems crazy viscous for a small engine, but may be needed to keep oil consumption down.

Before I get too deep into this, have you any idea if Amsoil is available in Taiwan?

Maybe start with this: Amsoil Scooter Oil

Thanks,

Paul

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#1007240 - 10/09/07 07:43 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: Pablo]
rakuentw Offline


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 17
Loc: taiwan
No,I never see this word "Amsoil" before i visit this forum.
i think Taiwanese don't know this brand,
and no store sell Amsoils.

We know Mobil,Castrol,BP,Shell....
these brands are very popular.
some body may use motocycle/car company's brand oil.

there are 50-100 oil brands in Taiwan,but no Amsoil.

and i search the word "Amsoil" @ taiwan google ,
some results tell me this brand ever been imported(small amount),i think it will be very expensive and hard to find.

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#1007241 - 10/09/07 08:49 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oil? [Re: rakuentw]
todds21 Offline


Registered: 05/30/05
Posts: 87
Loc: texas
My wife rides a Kymco scooter. I believe the manual states to use a 15w40. I have been running Amsoil 10w40 with good results. I like the idea of a synthetic in this air cooled motor becuase it gets run pretty hard (hig revving)and its HOT in Texas a good portion of the year.

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#1007242 - 10/09/07 09:48 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: todds21]
rakuentw Offline


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 17
Loc: taiwan
is Amoil 10w40($6.3) better than
shell advance vsx4 10w40($5.5~$6)?


i don't know 15w-40 is crazy viscous or not.
but many people use xW50 oil
ex: Mobil super 4T 15w50 is familiar in Taiwan


i usually use 10w40 car oil on scooter
(motocycle oil is expensive than car oil)

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#1007243 - 10/09/07 10:23 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: rakuentw]
rakuentw Offline


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 17
Loc: taiwan
PS.
Taiwan's temperature:
hottest summer 95'F ~ coldest winter 50'F

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#1007244 - 10/10/07 01:23 AM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: rakuentw]
warchildindy Offline


Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 110
Loc: indiana, usa
Hello and welcome. Can you buy shell rotella 15w-40 or shell rotella synthetic 5w-40 (blue bottle)? We use these(2) oils in a Roketa MAUI 50 scooter with great results. I also use the Shell synthetic 5w-40 in a air cooled 1634cc Victory Motorcycle with great results. It is good oil at a good price here in the USA.

Yes, you are correct that the manual calls for 1000km oil change intervals (oci). The engine and gear oil is initially changed at 300km. Gear oil oic is 5000km after breakin.

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#1007245 - 10/10/07 01:38 AM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oil? [Re: Tree Hugger]
azsynthetic Offline


Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 1218
Loc: Phoenix AZ
Quote:

I don't see any point in using synthetic in that engine, The maker's reccomended oil change interval seems a little short for a 1 litre oil capacity - that would be about equivalent to a 3,000 mile (5,000 Km) on a normal car over here.
That would be well within Chevron Supreme's capability, even the SG rating. If you are actually getting SM rated oil now, I wouldn't hesitate to extend it to 1500 KM or even 2,000 KM.
For sure, 1,000 KM on Chevron Supreme SM would be perfectly safe....




I don't think you understand motorcycle usage in Asia. I have lived in Thailand, Vietnam, Laos, Philipines, and Taiwan and I can tell you that 1K OCI is for an average rider. Extreme riders will change it sooner. To save gas, most motorcycles (50-125cc) will have the idle set way below the factory recommended value (400-500rpm instead of 900-1100rpm). This low idle couples with engine lugging in traffic while being overloaded cause a severe fuel dilution problem. Also, people that own motor bikes do not walk, even for a 100m distance, so they might start and stop the engine 10-20 times a day to go somewhere. Compound this problem is the extremely humid and dusty tropical climate and most engines are aircooled.

Prior to 911, every time I go oversea I would pack a case of synthetic oil (6qts) in my carry on. Can't do that any more but luckly I still have enough for all my scooters. I still have 2 Honda Futures and a Suzuki Viva-R that I use when I go native. I am using mostly Belray and Mobil synthetic oil with a 5K OCI, but then again I do not lug the engine and my idle are correctly set.

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#1007246 - 10/10/07 02:01 AM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: warchildindy]
rakuentw Offline


Registered: 10/07/07
Posts: 17
Loc: taiwan
i found shell rotella 15w-40 on yahoo auction (taiwan)
$3.79/Quart.

is Shell synthetic 5w40 = shell helix 5w40(full syn)?
$8.49/Quart.

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#1007247 - 10/10/07 02:53 AM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: rakuentw]
warchildindy Offline


Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 110
Loc: indiana, usa
The shell rotella synthetic 5w-40 is designed for diesel engines first, and can be used in gasoline engines. It is a group III synthetic with a strong additive package. It sells here for $16.00 to $19.00 U.S. for a gallon and about $3.50 to $5.00 U.S. for a quart.

Shell does not make a motorcycle oil for the U.S. market. I am not sure of the Shell helix 5w-40 formulation. I know that it is used overseas in Mercedes and other cars that call for a 5w-40. I understand that it is a good oil.

With that said, even if I could get the Shell Helix 5w-40 for $8.49 per quart, I would not. I am happy with the Shell Rotella 15w-40 and 5w-40 diesel oils (dino and group III synthetic).

If the shell helix 5w-40 synthetic is like the german castrol 0w-30 formulations that are made overseas, then no, the Shell Rotella 5w-40 synthetic does not equal the Shell helix 5w-40 synthetic. I base this on group III vs. group IV or higher full synthetic base stock.

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#1007248 - 10/10/07 02:46 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: warchildindy]
Jaybird Offline


Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 608
Loc: So. IN
You are using a very reasonably priced top shelf quality oil, along with a very reasonable oil change interval.
I wouldn't change one thing at all.

Some of you guys absolutely kill me with your sales pitches and lobbying for your favorites.
Which of you can honestly say he needs to change anything at all? And if you can, please share the precise knowledge as to "why" with us.

IMO, the oil he is using is probably robust enough to compete with any of the higher priced shelf, or boutique oils, including all of those mentioned. And none of them can beat the price he is paying...so penny for penny, he probably has the best oil he could possibly choose.

By the way, welcome to the board, rakuentw.
_________________________
Try not...do or do not, there is no try. -Yoda

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#1007249 - 10/10/07 05:44 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: Jaybird]
warchildindy Offline


Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 110
Loc: indiana, usa
Jaybird, you are right. I told him that the shell helix is top shelf oil. Rakuentw was asking for a strategy to pick the best oil. Good luck. That is why we have and use the bitog.

He stated earlier that he was using automotive chevron 10w-40 at $2.00 a quart. Which would be probably fine at a good price, for 1000km ocis in a scooter engine.

We have an asian scooter also. Our scooter manual recommends 15w-40 at 1000km ocis. The scooter shop oil is $10.00 Our experience for a good economical oil is definitely the Shell rotella 15w-40 dino to stay in specs. The shell rotella synthetic 5w-40 also, if he wants to jump to a low priced group III synthetic. As stated before, I use this in a large air cooled v-twin motorcycle engine, with good results.

I get the impression, that he is worried about not using synthetic oil, for whatever reason.

I can understand this feeling. I have used the over priced boutique oils also. They are excellent for high performance extended ocis, but for my use, overkill as a whole. I think everyone has too experience that for themself.

I am a child of the 50's. Today's oils are definitely better across the board. Not too many bad oils, just some better suited than others, for certain applications.

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#1007250 - 10/10/07 06:19 PM Re: How to choose 4T Scooter Motocycle's engine oi [Re: warchildindy]
Jaybird Offline


Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 608
Loc: So. IN
From what I read, the question is how to form the best strategy in choosing an engine oil for the scooter.
Not what the best oil is.

Best, is a relative term to begin with.
Many factors enter in when assessing the "best" engine lubricant, and then only credible for that particular application.

Adequate should be considered more than a search for the best. Anything past adequate is overkill, and in most cases, costly.

Taking into consideration the mfg requirements, and adding in the cost factor, and perhaps availability, and you have a decent strategy. Which can of course be enhanced with additional input, gained from real world testing of the product.

Or we can simply ask here at BITOG what the best oil to use is, and have lots of sales pitches and lobbying for favorites to read through.
_________________________
Try not...do or do not, there is no try. -Yoda

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